What Does "United Front" Parenting Mean/look like to You?

I'd say the very first thing you need to do is go out and buy that new shower caddy. It's ridiculous that something like that is causing WW3 in your house. It should have been done ages ago. Also, get a handheld shower head to replace your fixed one. That way, your son can remove the shower head and bring it UP to his own head and not have to bend down. They're not expensive and they're not difficult to install.

As far as undermining your husband, yeah, you kinda did. He definitely overreacted to the morning noise (although it must have REALLY been bothering him and he's probably been holding it in for ages and he just finally couldn't take it anymore). But YOUR reaction to your son implied that you thought your husband was being ridiculous and a joke and now your son has lost just a tiny bit of respect for him, which you have allowed.

I think you should have told your son "The noise must really be bothering him in the morning. I'll get a new caddy, but maybe in the meantime, you can try to be more careful in the shower and I'll talk to him about the situation. I'm sure there's a way we can figure this out." Or something more diplomatic like that.

You must all be constantly walking on edge if something like this causes this much strife. Good luck at the counseling session next week.

OK, I'll be honest, I have to disagree with you here on some points.
To me, a united parenting front means the first thing you said - you discuss in advance those things that are predictable and/or ongoing for consistent discipline. But additionally, I think it means that you don't disagree on a punishment given by the other parent IN THE CHILD'S PRESENCE. Do you have to agree if you don't think it makes sense? No, but you discuss it out of earshot of the child to come up with a solution that you can both live with.

In the example that you give, when the child said "DH said I can't shower in the morning because I'm too loud." I would have said something non-committal like "Oh really? Hmmm." And then PRIVATELY said to my DH "What's this about?" And after a discussion about being too loud, tried to come up with a different solution (eg, get a new shower caddy/find a different way to secure it/put the bottles somewhere else). Then your DH could have gone back to your son and said "It is important to be respectful of others early in the morning, and I'd like to give you another chance to do that. We got a new caddy to try to keep things from falling. Do you think you can try to be quieter? If so, you can shower in the mornings again." (or something like this)

The point is that since DH assigned the discipline, DH should be the one to reverse it. The way that you handled it, yes, you did undermine his authority.

Okay:
1) So Husband should BUY ANOTHER shower caddy... that is to his liking and noise level. Because, shower caddies can make noise, even an adult using it things can fall out of it. ie: like me.
So INSTEAD of telling your son he can't shower in the morning... Husband should problem solve this and BUY ANOTHER shower caddy. Since the current one is so irritating to him.
2) The other complication is, that you are a blended family. So lots of room for contradictions and he said/she said type of things, and who rules the roost more sort of things too.
3) Your Husband has an "authority" hang up. And feels you undermine... him. He is probably a tad of a chauvanist. If you don't mind my saying.
Well, the reality is: you are both adults. And parents. AND, in daily life... each parent makes a call or decision on things... especially when the other Spouse/parent is NOT there. That is life. And being you are spouses... there should be trust and the feeling that each other makes the best decision, per the kids/home, if the other is not present. AND if, you need the other Spouse's opinion or FEEDBACK... then you pick up the phone and call the other one.
The point is: between spouses, there is FEEDBACK and bouncing ideas/thoughts, off of each other. NOT it being a dialogue of one is carte blanche more correct than the other, just for the sake of being the "authority" in the house and it being a pecking-order and totem-pole of who is more above, the other or not.
4) Your Husband seems to have the attitude and inane ideas, that belittles you. Because, he thinks he is the all knowing "authority" on things.
But NO... he is not. That is life. Too bad.
And, his insulting you and/or in front of the kids... undermines, YOU. And thus, HE IS UNDERMINING, you, too. Just as he accuses you of doing to, him.

5) Your Husband, is rigid and chauvanistic. Thus, he thinks he is right and you are never right. But in a relationship, it is not about who is right and who is wrong. Because, in a relationship, it ideally is a RAPPORT.... of 2 people getting feedback from each other and having a 2-way conversation about things. But for your Husband, he is a one-way street. ie: his way or the highway type attitude...and anyone who doesn't agree with him or do as he wants, is wrong.
And that is, wrong. That is childish. That is immature. And his propensity for that attitude... is what is DERAILING... things in the house. And between you. And between the children.
And probably, the kids don't like him????? Or feel he is impossible????

Your Husband is very rigid. And his attitude is NOT conducive, to anyone else. Only to him and for him. But he is continually frustrated and mad. Because, he only wants his way, and for it to happen with the snap of a finger. And he thinks his way will be the most successful. But it is not. It has already been, proven. Because, things are not happening to HIS, way. Well no wonder. He is, an unbending, rigid, alienating person who is harsh on everyone. And what is that getting him? Success? Or, people who are unhappy with him?
Because he does not have a rapport with anyone, because he only wants things, per his "authority."
And that is just so misaligned.
He does not know how, to have a relationship with anyone in the house.
He only does, what he feels are his "laws." And what is that based on? Himself.
And he is sabotaging himself.
Because, he will not, have a nice fair 2-way rapport with people in the house and with you, and he does not know what feedback is, versus inhuman "laws" which he translates into his "authority" power, for himself.
And then lords it over, all of you.

In a home with a Spouse and with kids... it cannot be a dictatorship.
And he is undermining you.
And you are his Wife. Therefore, he has to be a good Husband too. And not be so selfish by lording his "authority" over you and everyone.
A secure Man/Husband, will be more human. And understanding of life's multiple scenarios.

In my family, me and my husband at times, have different approaches to handling the kids and making decisions. But overall, he trusts my judgement. And I trust his. And we will defer to another, if/when we ourselves cannot make up our minds. But mostly, I can make decisions without my Husband's "approval" and he can too if I am not there.
And if perhaps we don't agree 100% with the other per discipline or heavy decisions with the kids, we will have a CONVERSATION about it, together, and give FEEDBACK to another. It not being... a dictatorial mandate by the other.

Do I, back my Spouse on consequences/rule changes that make no sense just to maintain peace?
No. Not always.
Why?
Because, I have an opinion and a gut feeling on things and I KNOW my kids. AND if, I do not feel my Husband's approach/attitude toward the kids are fair, I say so. Right there. In an even keeled voice. ALSO because, I WANT my kids.... to see AND learn, that marriage/spouses... DO NOT have to be, just mindless robots to each other. And in life, I want my kids to see me/my Husband, have a dialogue about things and what our thought processes are.... to then reach a conclusion/decision, about them. And especially with my son and daughter... I WANT them to see me, a Wife and Mommy... having my own ideas too, and that I can put it forth and stand up to what I feel, is not fair. And how to do it. By my example. Mind you, when I say my opinion to my Husband, is it NOT "undermining" him. It is, OFFERING another.... perspective... to the problem at hand or issue. And I say so. And I say it in a non-hazardous manner. But I say it.
I want my kids... to LEARN that. By my example.
And I tell my daughter... that one day she will be a wife. And that, she has her own thoughts. And that, if something is wrong or does not feel right... she has a right to say so. And for my son, I tell him, that just because he is a boy and one day will be a Man, it does not make his opinions more important than the girl. EACH person, has to think... and think it out... and know what is fair or not, right or wrong.
And I WILL... at any time, be an example for my kids... even if that may make my Husband mad. I do stand up for things and to him, when it is plainly, wrong. Or idiotic. Or mean. etc.
Because, in the LONG run, I want my kids to see/hear the PROCESS of HOW.... my thoughts are and what I explain and know as fair/unfair, right/wrong, and what is just plain ILLogical. And how to speak up etc. in various ways. And why.
That is important to me as a parent to teach my kids, so that my kids... can see an actual example, of rapport. Even amidst differences, in a relationship. And how I go about it. And when I am wrong, I say so. As well.

Then, there have been times when, say my daughter was wrongly scolded or punished for something by my Husband. My Husband not even knowing the full situation or what happened. AND I went WITH my daughter... to my Husband, and told her she CAN... tell Daddy. And not be afraid. AND that, Daddy will listen. Just talk in a mature manner etc. AND she did. And my Husband listened and 'heard' her. AND he would then apologize. Because he then knew, he was wrong.
You see, it is not about who has "authority" in the house or not, or if that is a man or woman. The point for me and with my kids is... being able to know how to process thoughts/issues/communicate it and speak up. And later as an adult or being someone's Girlfriend or Boyfriend... I WANT my daughter or son, to know... how to handle it. And not just because a man is the "authority" in the house.
My own late Dad, taught me that.

mynewnickname has a point.

But I'm glad you have counseling coming up, because there's some stuff here that needs to be dealt with. Your husband was WAY out of line on this and THAT is the real issue. Maybe you let things slide when he thinks you shouldn't, but that doesn't mean he can make unreasonable demands/punishments because he's letting things simmer.

The blaming needs to stop, and you guys have to figure out how do pull it together and have reasonable expectations.

I do think your undermined your husbands authority..... even if it was a parenting mistake. BUT I'VE SCREWED UP TOO! In the future if that happened again I think I would say to my son, "Oh really? Well sounds like you both had a rough morning. Let's talk about it again later." Then I would talk to your husband about it. Come to an agreement and let HIM take the punishment back if it is agreed to do so.

Glad you have a counseling session. A little help with communicating is always good!

In this instance I think I would have checked with my husband first. Saying to your son "he can't possibly have said this" was making an assumption on your part, one that turned out to be false. How hard is it to say, honey, just to be clear, did you actually tell our son this? I mean, you didn't have to stop what you were doing and call him right then and there but you could have asked him about it later. Step parent or not I think I would have been irritated too, if my husband just told one of our kids, no, don't listen to your mother, she couldn't have meant that.

Had I been in your situation, I probably would have said to the son:"You know, that's news to me. I think, before I give you an answer, I want to check in with him (your husband)."

Personally, I can see both sides of it. Yes, it WAS a ridiculous edict to begin with. AND I can understand why your husband felt undermined because you made a statement without checking in with him.

In our house, a united front *is* what we strive for. Right now, with our son still being young, things regularly come up which challenge us. We are experiencing some of that "I'll ask Parent #1 for something, and if I don't get the answer I want, I'll go ask Parent #2." Being a parenting team, this often means double-checking with each other about "so, when Kiddo asked you for X, what did you tell him?" -- this way, one of us doesn't inadvertently give permission for something the other parent has already vetoed.

When we see continual problems arising, we do some private problem-solving on our own so that new strategies/consequences are agreed-upon in advance. It's been hard for me (with my background working with kids) not to intercede when Kiddo and his father are working through something, but now I just keep my mouth shut and let my husband figure it out. If I do hear something from really out of left field, I might say "Oh, honey, I hate to interrupt, but could you help me for a minute?" and then we can privately discuss what's going on before he returns to the conversation. This way, my son isn't privy to our discussion, I can tell my husband why I think something he's doing may be more problematic in the long run, and it gives him a chance to make a plan before walking back into the conversation. This way, I am supporting them both without allowing my son to think that I'm 'taking sides'-- he just thinks that maybe Dad came the decision on his own during the break.

I'm not sure if we handle things right or wrong at our house, but my husband would have never said that to my oldest son (his step-son) in the first place. If Husband had an issue with Son he would come to me first.

We've carried this to such an extent that I get sick of being in the middle at times. On the other hand my husband and son have a nice relationship and get along - probably because neither one grates on the other.

I just don't think that was an emergency situation where your husband should have issued that pronouncement. He could have waited to talk to you about it. Then you two could have been a united front in how to handle it.

Your husband set himself up for a dis-united front.

I don't think you handled it perfectly either - but honestly I would have been astounded if my husband told my son he couldn't shower in the morning. I get you being baffled by that one.

So my answer is no, I do not back my husband on consequences that don't make any sense and I wouldn't expect him to back me in that scenario either.

Presenting a united front basically means that, if your kid comes to each of you individually, he's going to get the same response to whatever it is he's wanting/doing, because you and your husband have discussed it. If you haven't discussed it, you don't give the kid any answer at all except, "I'll need to talk with Dad about it first."

Presenting a united front isn't about always agreeing. You might disagree on something, but you have to work out a compromise (or even give in on some things) in order present that united front to your child.

As for the shower situation, you should have believed your son when he stated that he was told by Dad not to take a shower in the morning. Why would your son have stated otherwise? Furthermore, you did undermine Dad's authority by allowing your son to shower in the morning after he'd been told no.

A better response might have been, "Yes, you should take your showers at night like Dad said. Once we get a new shower caddy that isn't always dropping stuff on the floor and making a lot of noise, Dad and I will talk about you being able to shower in the morning."

Sorry, hon, but it does look like you owe your husband an apology.

What you did was the complete opposite of united front parenting! No parent is right all the time and no 2 people are going to agree what is right all the time. The point of united front is that you support each other in front of the kids and address any disagreements in private not in front of the children. You basically let your son know that he doesn't have to listen to your husband and that you are the real authority figure. Why would he respect anything your husband tells him to do??

Note I am not saying your husband right in his reaction/punishment, just that you should have reacted differently if you are trying to practice united fron parenting.

You're both wrong. He should have never issued such a stupid ultimatum to your son. However he did, so you should have told your son to follow his step-dad's instructions and that you will talk to him. Then you sit down with hubby, explain your concerns like you did above, and try to come up with a compromise. Maybe he showers at night till the new caddy is purchased. Also compromise on the consequence, taking away his guitar is totally unrelated to the 'crime' and way out of proportion. Maybe if he breaks the rule he has to clean all the bathrooms in the house.

You are in the right on this. With my husband and I, we try to be on the same page, but when one of us is out of line we always make sure to call each other out on it (in private of course, not in front of the kids). And when we make a mistake out of anger (like your husband saying he can not shower because he was mad he got woke up) we admit we made a mistake to our kids, so they can see we are human and we all make mistakes. In this case your husband is being unreasonable.

In a case like this the underlying issue needs to be addressed. I see you mention getting a new shower caddy, which is good. Also, it is easy to replace a shower head and getting one with a removable arm will make it much easier for your tall son to rinse (I know, my husband is very tall as well). Just a thought.

Best of luck and Blessed Be.

your husband is being unreasonable. there's no way he should have instituted that rule or the consequence without checking with you first.
but he's right about you undermining him. you just handed your son a whip by saying 'you can't be serious' and telling him FIRST that you'd reverse your husband's edict.
a united front means that you do all the background negotiating there- behind the scenes. a better response would have been 'oh, i didn't realize that. i'll discuss it with your stepfather. for today, shower when you get home.'
my husband wouldn't have made such a loud and big 'rule' without discussing it with me, and there's no way i'd have undermined him if he had.
you both need to get better at this.
khairete
S.

How would YOU feel if your husband told one of the kids "your mother can't possibly be serious" and then just went ahead and took away a consequence you had imposed? Or that what you said "made no sense"? (your words, not mine) Wouldn't you feel not only undermined, but blatantly disrespected?
This is less about parenting and more about respect and communication between you and your husband. I think counseling is a good idea.

This isn't a parenting issue, and it isn't an authority issue. Good grief, husband. Your husband needs to get over himself. He's being completely, utterly unreasonable in his request which was over the top, and his reaction to you having rectified what was a serious problem for your son in an appropriate way was beyond "over the top" and "unreasonable."

I mean... you describe him as outraged and this starting WW3. Really? Over a young man showering and rattling a shower caddy? Get the truck over yourself, dude. Get some ear plugs rather than telling the poor kid he's not ever, ever allowed to shower in the mornings so your poor virgin ears aren't offended by normal morning routine sounds AND telling the kid that if he dares disobey his majesty's unreasonable demands he'll take away something that's the most valuable to him.

I honestly want to put Nair on your husband's head while he's sleeping, making it all spotty and uneven.

Great question.
We try to support each other in front of our son...and work out any disagreements in private.....Sometimes it is hard for me!!!!

Good Luck.

You should not have said to your son, he can't possibly be serious. That was undermining his authority. You should have said, really, I will look into that or something on that line. Even saying that sounds a bit harsh to me would have been fine. Saying I will speak to him. Saying his rule must be a joke is pretty bad.

Then you go to your husband and say that is pretty over the top and as bio I am taking veto rights. That way your husband could have gone to your son and said, I was a bit crabby, we need to get a new caddy, could you please keep it down until we do.

You didn't allow that, you completely undermined your husband. Not good.

My husband will come up with some over the top responses. I will say okay but only for this time period. If it was completely out of proportion I will say, not happening. At least that way he can go to the kids and say we discussed this, here is whatever, you need to clean up after yourself or in the future you will be punished.

So, he overreacted to the noises, you poorly addressed it, you owe him an apology for how you handled it.

I would also like to add has he complained about the noise in the morning to you? Did you do nothing? Why didn't you speak to your son and ask is there any way you could be quieter? Come up with ideas. Perhaps a shower mat to absorb some of the sound.

If you are doing nothing but shrugging your shoulders at every complaint you have to own part of his overreaction.

I just gotta say that your husband is using the "not undermining authority" to be a bully. I'm so glad that you're going to counseling with him.

When you talk this through, make sure you tell your husband in front of the counselor that THIS kind of stuff is what makes it so that kids don't come back home after they leave. And I mean that they don't come back to visit. If he wants to see his son as a grown up who brings back his wife and maybe children, your husband's grandchildren, he had better wise up. Or, is it that he doesn't care if he does because he's a step-son instead of a biological son?

I'd like these other posters to live in YOUR shoes for a week with a husband who acts like this about so many things (see Rosemud's post) and THEN tell you that you are wrong for saying he must be kidding...

And, DON'T tell your son he can't shower in the morning. That's just plain CRUEL.

I would call a cease fire. I would have a family meeting and brainstorm ideas. For example, my SS is very tall. So we got a double shower head at Home Depot. He uses the top one. We use the bottom one. If the caddy is loud, then who wants to pony up time or money to find a different one? In this case, I don't see it as united front. I see it as intrafamily conflict that can be resolved another way. I would talk to him and say that while I understood that he was upset, that I felt that it would not solve the issue long-term. So please work with me as a team. Your son is old enough to problem solve with you and his SF.

I would also ask SF if there are other issues (outside of this meeting) that he wants to address. It should not become "you are a terrible parent" but teamwork. Does SF feel disrespected by you and your son? If so, why? And how can THAT be resolved before he nukes things from orbit instead of working out a plan?

There have been times, both with my sks and with my DD, that DH and I have not been on the same page. Sometimes there's a compromise. Sometimes more info makes me realize that I was wrong, and I apologize to both the kid and my husband. Etc. I take situations one by one, but try to keep the same overall view with my DH.

It sounds to me that you were taken by surprise more than you were trying to undermine him. You didn't think he was serious.

You say you're in counseling, so that is also a good place to address this. Obviously your idea of a resolution and his are not the same and if I felt that my DH was overly harsh, I would talk to him.

In my home, for big consequences, I am the deputy. DH is the sheriff for the sks. He lays out grounding and such, even if I suggest it to him. I would not have taken my sks' guitar for this, but I would have tried to address it. There was a time when my SS was hitting snooze at 5:30AM, over and over and over...and waking me up. We had to get him a different alarm that woke him but not the house. That was what we came up with as a family.

You are wrong and you do owe him an apology.

While it is fundamentally stupid to impose such a rigid punishment for bathing, it also would seem to me like your son would just remove the caddy from the shower before he starts showering this way nothing falls and no noise is made since the issue is the noise.

What you did by telling your son he doesn't have to obey his step dad is particularly damaging. It did damage in many directions. It shows the kids they can come between the two of you, it showed your husband he isn't respected by you and the kid doesn't have to listen to him with your blessing, and the other kids watching WW3 as you put it now know how to wedge themselves between the 2 of you which also jeopardized their future relationships because they haven't really learned how to effectively settle a disagreement.

Since you disagreed with husband's stance it would have been more appropriate to some to some agreement with husband before giving kiddo the OK to disregard your husband's rules or requests.

My husband and I have 1 step child each. There are times when I don't agree with something he has put in place but talk to him about it and then we deal with the kids together. Most of the time the kids see a united front but on occassion I do go protective momma bear and every time I have to apologise to the kid and to hubby because I overstepped my boundary and the kid needs to just know hubby is the boss. My husband had the best interest of our boys in mind at all times. I will never know what it is like to become a man or become a good man. My husband does and I have to trust he knows what he is doing even when the mamma bear in me comes roaring out. I have to get her back under control because I know my husband loves both boys and wants nothing but the best for them.

I HATE being wrong but I sometimes am. I have to allow my husband to father both boys. I want them to because as awesome as he is and they can't do that if I get in the way of that process by protecting them from him when they don't need it.

Many good points already. I'm a stepparent and a parent, so I understand both sides.

This is not about the shower, or the noise, or the guitar. It's not about a problem shower caddy or a too-low shower head (although both could be fixed easily).

It's about a man who doesn't understand his role (as a stepfather-role model) and who doesn't feel respected in the role he does have (as a "secondary" parent). Your husband DOES understand that you deal with teenagers by dealing in their "currency" (what's important to them - in this case, the guitar). But he's missed the point on when that's a reasonable and justifiable threat. He also doesn't understand that teenagers are infuriatingly clueless about a lot of things, and sometimes uncoordinated as they learn to deal with their growing/changing bodies. A lot of teen boys just don't know what to do with all that height. Plus they're distracted.

This issue is also about what it means to be "the man of the house" (antiquated as some of that notion is) and how hard it is to be the "sometimes parent" - meaning you can make decisions in an emergency and as long as it's a decision no one else feels strongly about. I suspect your husband doesn't feel all that appreciated - by you perhaps, by your son. He probably gets plenty of "you're not my father" attitude, either in direct remarks or by implication. And that comes across as "you don't matter and you don't deserve my respect." That's inexcusable but unfortunately is the reality in many blended families. Taking away the "right" of your husband to make the decision about the shower just makes him feel more worthless. I agree with you that his decision was hasty and out of proportion, but the ensuing battle is not about that anymore.

You are correct that a major decision should be discussed with you. But it might help, in counseling, to recognize that your husband is lying there awake, maybe thinking, "Okay, here we go, another day in the life of a man who is not respected by the son in his house." So he goes ballistic.

Probably the counselor will suggest that everyone in the house needs to flex a bit. The son can show more respect to his stepfather (and perhaps to his mother - maybe your husband is seeing some teen backlash against all authority, including yours?), the stepfather can wait a while on non-urgent things and let you step in, and you can back him up in a JOINT family discussion about issues more important than shower noise, and you can all three go out for a new shower caddy and a shower head that bends up enough for a growing teen to get clean.

Another small point - teens (especially boys) may sweat at night and NEED a morning shower, but if they come home from activities really stinky, they may need one at night too. He should be allowed to have a solid shower and a quick rinse twice a day if necessary (not necessarily draining the hot water tank for both), and you should be delighted that he's actually showering without you nagging him.

You should have talked with your husband in private, convinced him to see it your way, then he could rescind his own dictate to your son.

That is how United Front works. Instead, you did undermine him (even though he WAS being ridiculous) and you allowed your son to play you off each other. Kid 1, Parents 0.

BTW - Get rid of the shower caddy, problem solved for everyone.