Two Boys Getting to Be a Hand Full

I am a 28 yr old single mother. My son is going to be 4 in June and I have the same issues. I give him a talk every morning in the car before going into daycare. I tell him if he gets a bad report from school he isn't getting any treats after school (this includes his night snack). I have had to go as far as taking his outdoor play time away. The key that I have found is to find his favorite thing. My son would rather run around the back yard then watch tv. If its raining out and he has been bad he gets the tv taken away from him. He is starting to realize it can get very boring after school when he is bad. Good Luck...I know its hard, at least she has you because my mother isn't around so I do it alone.

It sounds like your daughter needs to have a talk with the day care provider and find out how she's dealing with the situation. Name-calling and saying stuff like "you're not my mom" sounds like pretty normal stuff that the provider needs to deal with when it happens, with some kind of stern talk or time-out. Disciplining the boys hours later at home probably won't have much effect. The provider may be over her head. Or she might have suggestions,

If your grandson is in day care and not school at 6, it could be that he's a lot older than the other kids and is expiramenting with throwing his weight around.

Hi K.,
The key is to show a united front. No the sitter isn't their mother, but she is in charge and what she says is the same as their mom being there. Also, the discipline technique should be the same. We connect their school/daycare behaviour with activities. Nintendo, TV, bike riding, etc. Misbehave at school and lose a fun thing for 2 days.
Good luck.
M.

Since they respond to your correction, I would check into what's going on there at the sitter's. Maybe they are being bullied or maybe they are board. When my oldest was young, I had to work outside the home too. He would get into all kinds of "trouble" at the sitter's. We took him out and put him into a more active child care place and he was sooooo much happier. Turns out, the sitter didn't take him outside much and wanted him to sit and play quite most of the time. That's not what works with most boys. They are created to burn energy!

Behavior is a child's way of telling us something's up when they don't know how to put what they are feeling into words. And please keep in mind that not all people interpret behavior the same. What I mean is, the sitter may feel that some behavior is "bad" when it's not that big a deal to you. Hope this makes sense to you like it does in my brain. LOL

Take Care, N.=) F.R.O.G. IT!
Wife to the greatest man for 15yrs & blessed to be a SAHM of 3 AWESOME boys 12, 7 & 2 yrs old.

There is a respect issue. If the children don't do this at your house they do it at home more than likely. When the children are at the childcare the setter needs to directly punish the child calling names RIGHT when he does it. The first look that says
"I'm about to call you a name or the start of name calling" He needs to be told "We don't talk like that here" and be taken by the hand or picked up and put on time out away from the other kids. If he throws a fit he needs to be taken into another room and left there, where it's safe. If there isn't a safe place the setting needs to keep the child with him by their side. Do not let the child have control over what he wants to do for the next 5 min. After he has followed your directions for 5min. than say since your following my directions you are welcome to go play. If he stats up again than repeat it again. Do it over and over until he stops. There is no need to punish when they get home that is too late. (only if he is doing the same thing at home should so punish and it should be the same thing the sitter is doing. Doing this will teach who is in charge so they will follow your directions. Your directions are "We don't talk like that" Good luck this will take energy but will work out in the end.

i think you've gotten some good advice so far. my experience has been that my 4-yr old acts out when she wants/needs more attn. it's hard, even with a partner, to give kids the quality time they need/deserve, when you're trying to balance work and everything else. after a period of acting out/talking back in daycare, my husband and i redoubled our efforts to spend more time with her in the evening. no TV -- just play, reading, and hanging out. it makes a huge difference!

also, we recognized that she is much more cooperative throughout the day when we keep her on a set schedule and make sure she gets adequate rest. the experts will tell you that keeps love routine. i'd read it/heard it, but i didn't really KNOW it until this little girl put us to the test. routine works!

good luck to you and your daughter.

Hi K.,

I think Sandy's advice of using positive discipline is sound advice. All child therapists will agree with this. To effectively 'solve' this behavior problem, I would say that you, their mother and the sitter should take some time to read a book about positive discipline. Its a very effective technique which helps children regulate their behavior without comprimising their self esteem. These are a few books:

P.E.T. - Parent effectiveness training (they also have one for teachers).

How to talk so that kids will listen, how to listen so that kids will talk

Becoming the parent you always wanted to be

Time In

Good luck. These boys are lucky to have you around. Very few children have the 'luxury' of extended family who are involved in their lives on a daily basis.

J.

Hi K.,

Are you saying that the babysitter is reporting the behavior of the two boys?

Or are you having problem with the behavior of the two boys?

Just want to know. Thanks D.

These boys are missing their dad. Get him more involved in their lives no matter what. Even if the parents do not get along, you cannot not keep them from their father without them suffering the consequences. They are males and need a male in their lives; unless it is not a positive influence.

This is not a direct answer to your dilema but I read this in January and found it to be very helpful. I would talk at length to the daycare provider to find out what is going on while they are there, what she is doing and to try to come up with ways to help the boys together, if possible.

25 WAYS TO TALK SO YOUR CHILDREN WILL LISTEN
A major part of discipline is learning how to talk with children. The
way you talk to your child teaches him how to talk to others. Here are
some talking tips we have learned with our children:

1. Connect before you direct
Before giving your child directions, squat to your child's eye level
and engage your child in eye-to-eye contact to get his attention.
Teach him how to focus: "Mary, I need your eyes." "Billy, I need your
ears." Offer the same body language when listening to the child. Be
sure not to make your eye contact so intense that your child perceives
it as controlling rather than connecting.

2. Address the child
Open your request with the child's name, "Lauren, will you please..."

3. Stay brief
We use the one-sentence rule: Put the main directive in the opening
sentence. The longer you ramble, the more likely your child is to
become parent-deaf. Too much talking is a very common mistake when
dialoging about an issue. It gives the child the feeling that you're
not quite sure what it is you want to say. If she can keep you talking
she can get you sidetracked.

4. Stay simple
Use short sentences with one-syllable words. Listen to how kids
communicate with each other and take note. When your child shows that
glazed, disinterested look, you are no longer being understood.

5. Ask your child to repeat the request back to you
If he can't, it's too long or too complicated.

6. Make an offer the child can't refuse
You can reason with a two or three-year-old, especially to avoid power
struggles. "Get dressed so you can go outside and play." Offer a
reason for your request that is to the child's advantage, and one that
is difficult to refuse. This gives her a reason to move out of her
power position and do what you want her to do.

7. Be positive
Instead of "no running," try: "Inside we walk, outside you may run."

8. Begin your directives with "I want."
Instead of "Get down," say "I want you to get down." Instead of "Let
Becky have a turn," say "I want you to let Becky have a turn now."
This works well with children who want to please but don't like being
ordered. By saying "I want," you give a reason for compliance rather
than just an order.

9. "When...then."
"When you get your teeth brushed, then we'll begin the story." "When
your work is finished, then you can watch TV." "When," which implies
that you expect obedience, works better than "if," which suggests that
the child has a choice when you don't mean to give him one.

10. Legs first, mouth second
Instead of hollering, "Turn off the TV, it's time for dinner!" walk
into the room where your child is watching TV, join in with your
child's interests for a few minutes, and then, during a commercial
break, have your child turn off the TV. Going to your child conveys
you're serious about your request; otherwise children interpret this
as a mere preference.

11. Give choices
"Do you want to put your pajamas on or brush your teeth first?" "Red
shirt or blue one?"

12. Speak developmentally correctly
The younger the child, the shorter and simpler your directives should
be. Consider your child's level of understanding. For example, a
common error parents make is asking a three-year- old, "Why did you do
that?" Most adults can't always answer that question about their
behavior. Try instead, "Let's talk about what you did."

13. Speak socially correctly
Even a two-year-old can learn "please." Expect your child to be
polite. Children shouldn't feel manners are optional. Speak to your
children the way you want them to speak to you.

14. Speak psychologically correctly
Threats and judgmental openers are likely to put the child on the
defensive. "You" messages make a child clam up. "I" messages are
non-accusing. Instead of "You'd better do this..." or "You must...,"
try "I would like...." or "I am so pleased when you..." Instead of
"You need to clear the table," say "I need you to clear the table."
Don't ask a leading question when a negative answer is not an option.
"Will you please pick up your coat?" Just say, "Pick up your coat,
please."

15. Write it
Reminders can evolve into nagging so easily, especially for preteens
who feel being told things puts them in the slave category. Without
saying a word you can communicate anything you need said. Talk with a
pad and pencil. Leave humorous notes for your child. Then sit back and
watch it happen.

16. Talk the child down
The louder your child yells, the softer you respond. Let your child
ventilate while you interject timely comments: "I understand" or "Can
I help?" Sometimes just having a caring listener available will wind
down the tantrum. If you come in at his level, you have two tantrums
to deal with. Be the adult for him.

17. Settle the listener
Before giving your directive, restore emotional equilibrium, otherwise
you are wasting your time. Nothing sinks in when a child is an
emotional wreck.

18. Replay your message
Toddlers need to be told a thousand times. Children under two have
difficulty internalizing your directives. Most three- year-olds begin
to internalize directives so that what you ask begins to sink in. Do
less and less repeating as your child gets older. Preteens regard
repetition as nagging.

19. Let your child complete the thought
Instead of "Don't leave your mess piled up," try: "Matthew, think of
where you want to store your soccer stuff." Letting the child fill in
the blanks is more likely to create a lasting lesson.

20. Use rhyme rules.
"If you hit, you must sit." Get your child to repeat them.

21. Give likable alternatives
You can't go by yourself to the park; but you can play in the neighbor's yard.

22. Give advance notice
"We are leaving soon. Say bye-bye to the toys, bye-bye to the girls…"

23. Open up a closed child
Carefully chosen phrases open up closed little minds and mouths. Stick
to topics that you know your child gets excited about. Ask questions
that require more than a yes or no. Stick to specifics. Instead of
"Did you have a good day at school today?" try "What is the most fun
thing you did today?"

24. Use "When you…I feel…because…"
When you run away from mommy in the store I feel worried because you
might get lost.

25. Close the discussion
If a matter is really closed to discussion, say so. "I'm not changing
my mind about this. Sorry." You'll save wear and tear on both you and
your child. Reserve your "I mean business" tone of voice for when you
do.

I agree with others in that you should find out how it is being handled in the moment...if it isn't being adressed until they are picked up, what is the point in that?
Also, maybe seeking out a new way for you both to handle and dicipline them, if what you are doing is not working anymore. Some suggestions to try, maybe create a chart at home, with both of their names, and give them each a sticker to put under their name for each day they behave appropriately in daycare, making sure to explain thoroughly what is acceptable, and what isn't. Have some type of reward after so many good days for each of them. When they get the reward, start the chart again, only with more stickers required for the next reward. Or if there is something they enjoy playing with a lot, take it away when they get home if they didn't behave at daycare that day. Hopefully you can find something that is important to them to inspire the appropriate behavior.
I would, however, talk to the day care providers to come up with appropriate discipline in the moment of this behavior. Good luck!
K.

Hi K.;

I too am a single mother of a 4 year old boy and understand how difficult certain behaviors can be. There are several issues to consider.
1. How does the baby sitter address the children? Does she yell? Do you or your daughter ever drop in to check on the kids while they are in daycare? Dropping in without forewarning could help you to see her actions around your grandchildren.
2. What do they watch on television? I monitor or pre-record much of what I allow my son to watch. Inappropriate language is expressed in many popular cartoons that children end up using. When I let my son watch something that was not within his norm of shows, his behavior changed and his aggression increased. This is something to consider and do a test on them. Remove violent cartoons (no guns, no foul language such as stupid, idiot, dumb, etc.). We as adults have become too desensitized to violent/aggressive/disrespectful behavior. Allow them only to see shows that develop motor skills and behavior. Ms. Spider, The Land Before Time, The Backyardigans, Diego are just some examples.
3. What types of physical activities does your daughter have time to do with them? Consider buying a soccer ball and taking them to the park to kick the ball. They need to be shown examples of constructive energy, not destructive. I as a single parent commute (to daycare and then work) at least 1.5 hours 5 days a week. My recreational time with my son is limited in the evening, but we have a light ball that we toss to eachother or I have him help me wash dishes or do some light house cleaning. He feels helpful and boys who are growing into men need to feel useful. This is EXTREMELY important. I buy organic house cleaners so that he can help. Yes, it takes a little more time but that's okay. This boosts his self esteem and he feels helpful. I commend him on the good job he did helping me and what a difference "you did a great job" makes to a little boys self esteem.
4. Consider the other children in their environment. They may be getting some of their behavior from the other children/adults they interact with. Yes, we teach our children the difference between good/bad, right/wrong but part of what they learn is determined by what they see and hear.
5. Do you pray? I cannot begin to express to you how much prayer has changed and helped me and my son. I did not believe in prayer when I had him but unfortunate circumstances brought me to a point of hopelessness when he was about 1 year old. I had tried alternatives to helping myself but they didn't work. I am not God. I need help. You are a blessing to your daughter. She needs the help. Your grandsons have tremendous potential. How you decide to bring out that potential is up to you guys.
6. Since you mentioned the father was in the children's lives, she may consider talking with him about a team activity to get the kids involved in or encourage him to take the boys to the park or tumble with them. Since the father is involved, this needs to be a team effort. It would be a shame for your daughter to begin implementing some changes and then for the father to disregard them.
It takes a village to raise children and I hope these suggestions help you and your daughter to find some alternatives to the problems before you.

All the best,
Carla

Go to the bookstore and buy two copies of the book "1,2,3, Magic". Give one to the babysitter and you and your daughter read the other. Discuss the strategies and be consistant across the board. If everyone presents a united front, things should improve.

What is the sitter doing when the boys act up? How is she responding? My sitter seems to handle things properly when my 2 yo acts out, but there have been times that he's done things that she thought were minor or since he didn't actually bite, he just tried it's not worth a time out. I asked her to PLEASE give him timeouts for those things and explained why.

It's important that the parents and the daycare provider are a team in the discipline arena.

Where are you located. I am a mother of 3 kids. I have 2 boys and 1 girl. Maybe the boys need some other kids to paly with. I have an in-home daycare in my Spotsylvania/surrounding area home, and I have a small play group here, mabe that they dont want to be around big crowd of kids right now. My boys are 6 and 10, and as I see it, now boys are boys, and I do understand that, but maybe they need to be around other people. Let me know if you might have any other questions for me, I have AFFORDABLE RATES AND GREAT REFERENCES avialble and like I tell everyone that I talk to I ma CHEAPER than a regualar daycare center would be. You can either message me back on myspace at ____@____.com or you can email me at ____@____.com, if you might have any other questions. Good luck!

Thanks J.

I think it has to do with the daycare center. I stay at home with my girls because i want to and I hatye dayvare. I would asume it is someone or something at the daycare

Can you possibly go see a counselor or therapist for a little bit. It sounds like there is some unresolved anger or sadness going on that could be helped if the mother has a little idea of what's going on in their heads they can understand what mom can give and how they can help her to help them. As a mom with a really difficult child sometimes, I undrstand trying to figure out all this stuff and not have a lot of time and mental space to figure it out. I wish I could give you more...
A.