Need Help Dealing with a Mom in Moms Group. (LONG)

Any chance one of the mom's would be willing to take the lead and talk to her alone?

My guess is she is lonely, is lacking or feels she is lacking attention and feels inadequate to all of you and is over-compensating. Maybe one of you could take her out to dinner and gently bring it up?

I totally get where you are coming from-but I have a feeling in this case she isn't just a bossy bessie-there's more to it.

No, you don't sound like a horrible person at all. This is what I'd do: plan MNO's with the other moms....but don't invite "Gina." When Gina asks about a MNO, all of you mamas in the group say, " Gee, I'm busy that night/week. Can't do it this time around." This way you "phase her out," but continue to have a good time with the others. As for the playdates, it's easy to have "other things to do" to avoid going to her house, if that is what you and the others decide. Plan on meeting at someone elses house instead.

Oh, mom's groups. I'm surprised there isn't a reality show.

So, here's what I would say first. There is a good deal of research that suggests that parents of autistic children often fall on the spectrum themselves. (Please moms of autistic kids, don't message me). It's true! And some of the things you described sound a little like Asperger's:

Here's an excerpt from WebMD's definition of Asperger's:

Not pick up on social cues and may lack inborn social skills, such as being able to read others' body language, start or maintain a conversation, and take turns talking.

Talk a lot, usually about a favorite subject. One-sided conversations are common. Internal thoughts are often verbalized.

Ok, so there's like TWO symptoms out of their list but it describes pretty well what you are talking about, I think?

If that can help you understand her, or have empathy for her...and maybe her husband is this way as well. Maybe her husband has other deficits that are different than hers and between the two of them they passed on all of their spectrum issues to their kiddo who is autistic.

But, really whatever the cause, here's what I think and how I feel.

People are in our lives for a reason. Sorry to get all meta on you here but I think we come across people in our lives at certain time for certain reasons and the ones we have the most difficulty with can teach us a great deal about ourselves.

Clearly, you want to do the right thing but you also want to have appropriate boundaries and I think that's great.

You need to think about this situation not in terms of "us" (you and the other moms) but in terms of YOU, how YOU feel.

Sometimes being there for someone else and doing the right thing by someone else is good for our soul. You spent a whole summer with her and things worked out. Then, something shifted and it sounds like there's a little too much Gina in your life, so you need to pull back.

I would say that you stop the MNOs altogether for a little while--through the summer, maybe. Just do playdates, attend to other friendships and let Gina and everyone else know the MNOs just aren't going to work out for now. You're exhausted, you've got TONS and TONS of plans this summer. Hopefully she'll find something else to do and you can just kind of go your separate ways when it comes to socializing in that regard.

With the other moms, pick one and go to a movie one evening. Pick another and go to a book reading or a coffeehouse or to get a pedicure. Don't talk about Gina, don't say anything about the situation.

In the fall, you can resume MNO quietly and when you aren't in the same class and then you have a reason for it to just be you gals, it hopefully will avoid hurt feelings, and you can do a good thing for her and her kid/kids by doing playdates once in awhile while you taper off the "togetherness" but, do it with compassion and you will be better for it.

I really don't think talking to her about it is a good idea, as other moms have suggested. If you don't think she'd get it, it's probably because she won't. Most people have the ability to self regulate in social situations, if she doesn't then she needs more intervention than you can give her.

I've heard this approach used very effectively in group situations where one or two people seem to dominate:

"The conversation is not meeting MY NEEDS, and I'M FEELING (discouraged, distracted, bored, exhausted, annoyed, or some other real feeling). Would anybody besides me prefer that this discussion (get back on topic, be more inclusive, give everyone a chance, etc.)?" Alternately, "You know, I'M just not comfortable discussing this topic, so let's not go there, okay?"

Keeping the comment focused on your personal feelings, wants and needs without directly criticizing the dominator is a deft way to avoid unnecessary conflict or negativity.

I've been amazed at how that not only opens up or reorients the talk, but it also gently addresses the dominator's (probably unconscious) tactics without actually scolding her for it. And it gives the rest of the group a chance to show solidarity.

The dominating person may continue to draw the topic back into her own pet areas of interest, so you will have to repeat. But over time, it seems to help dominator become more aware that they're not the only breathing person in the room. And ultimately, that is a kindness to her.

Good luck. I'd love to hear how this turns out.

i think we all know someone like this, or at least someone whose social skills make others feel uncomfortable in some way and really just make people not want to be around them. i am sure the "ideal" thing to do would probably be to talk to her honestly, and she would "get" what you're saying, and change her ways, and everyone would live happily ever after. reality doesn't work that way. i suggest laying off the get togethers for awhile (just not feeling up to it right now, have too many things to do, it's just NOT WORKING FOR ME, etc) and then slowly start inviting the other girls to get together. no one has to tell her she has been excluded. it would hurt her feelings, and i'm sorry, but people don't really change that much. unless some huge life altering event happens. and this isn't it. you will either have to deal with her, or stop including her.

It sounds like you other moms still need the MNO to get a break once in awhile. So I am going to suggest something completely cowardly; but I think I have a good reason for it. Could you schedule a MNO on the down low and not invite her? I only suggest it because I really am not sure how anything good will come from talking to the mom about it. Her feelings will be hurt, she'll get defensive and will probably say something really hurtful to you. Then you'll just feel worse; at least now you feel bad but no one had said anything ugly that can't be taken back (except annoying mom).

Some people really just don't see the aggressiveness in their personalities and it rarely goes well if you try to talk to them about it. I know ducking around her doesn't address the issue, but things might just slide by the wayside if you all find a way to politely decline her MNO and playdates.

I wish you luck friend!

I think you should speak to her alone and tell her exactly what you told us. Tell her you feel she dominates the conversation, tries to control things, creates social awkwardness and comes across as competitive. You can try to sugar coat things if that is your style. Yes, she might get offended but you should have the gumption to tell her why you will all be abandoning her rather than just fleeing and letting her wonder. She might not know that she is coming across as unbearable. Good luck.

OK...hope I don't offend anyone, but if you need a laugh, google the Dane Cook 'Karen Skit'...it has some inappropriate language in it, so if you listen make sure the kids aren't around. But it kinda illustrates what you are talking about. I used to go to Girls Night Out with several girls from high school. We had a similar person in our group and little by little people stopped coming because of her. Now we don't meet at all. Kinda sad really! I do think that a direct approach is best. In my case, I wasn't brave enough to confront her...this person has a very strong, intimidating personality. A couple of us still see each other from time to time, but the group thing just didn't work. I wonder if it would have if one of us just talked to her :)

You can bust her balls the next time you guys meet and before she gets a chance to speak, open up w/ "Hey, what do you guys think of someone who completely dominates a group setting by talking all the time, criticizing the size of people's homes and talking about their marital problems?" and then sit back, drink your coffee or 'rita and watch nature take its course :)

When she starts up w/marital problems or trying to conduct Bible class, let her know it took alot for all of you to arrange time away from your husbands/kids and you don't want to spend your free time hearing so much negativity. I would say something like "I'm sorry but I get along w/my husband. He is a good man, husband and father and I have so much respect for him". If she retorts w/something like "some people can't help how their spouses turn out" then you can get her back w/ "Well, I guess I just know how to please my man" or something like that.

You aren't horrible. You just want to go out and have a good time w/your friends. Again, if it were me, I would get together w/the other friends w/o Debbie Downer and see how you guys get along w/o her.

some people dont realize how aggressive they are until they see themselves in video. do a cell or a cam video at next outing when she starts acting up. when its all over and done with view the video as a group and have an intervention so to speak.

You are not doing her any favors by continuing to listen to her go on and on while she is clueless about other people and their feelings.

If she is basically a kind, open person who is just socially inept, one of you could take a chance and talk to her in private. Some people are socially awkward but not defensive, and will take to heart any advice given in a compassionate manner.

However, your description of this woman - dominating, comparing, bragging, talking down to others, lacking empathy for other people's feelings - these are characteristics of a narcissist. If this woman is narcississtic, nothing you say will help her change because narcissists think they are right and better than everyone else. If this is the case, the best thing to do is to get out and not invest any more time in a friendship that will continue to be one-sided and frustrating.

Hi,

Wow, what a horrible situation to be in! I empathize with you-- you sound like a great friend and there really is a point when enough is enough. My suggestion is to talk to the other moms who feel the way you do and collectively decide to confront her at the MNO when she is doing this behavior. She may not know she is this way or she may not care. Either way, you don't have to stand for anyone talking down to you or dominating the convo's. The next time she does this--cut her off and say excuse me, but we are a group of moms looking to have a good time-its not your buisness or place to tell us how long we have to talk or how much you know about a subject. You need to learn how to behave in public and let others have their own views. We want you to feel welcome, but you need to stop this-its annoying! Let her know how you feel and that you don't like it. Give her an opportunity to change-if she doesn't--just say that its not working out with her coming to the groups, wish her well and say goodbye! Hopefully she will realize how she is acting and wise up-best wishes and I don't think your a horrible person at all- I think its commendable to try and work with someone like this who clearly is ridiculous! Take care--Molly

Wow!

I know someone like this, and I'll try not to make it about her. She was scary, after a few years, and very divisive, doing lots of things to cause arguments and dissent amongst a small group of friends who I'd previously known for a long time. It all started out benignly enough with that exact same :"Oh, let's talk about this controversial topic so we can better understand each other....and we'll all be so enlightened about it." Suffice it to say, everyone else was pretty cool about our differences to begin with and had been for years before she came along, but she wouldn't let things go. She didn't like that we could agree to disagree, because we valued our friendships with each other more than being 'right'. Even with the original three of us strategizing (trying to be proactive, smart and kind) we were eventually just worn out by this woman and her weird, baffling attempts to cause friction and turn us against each other.

She did have problems, deep deep problems, and my counselor at the time eventually told me that I'd have to either call her on the fact that she was 'spreading her sh*t around' (therapist's phrase, not mine) or just decide to be done. The fact that I even had to bring this up with a counselor somewhat decided things for me, and we let our 'group' activities come to an end. I couldn't avoid her, however, as she was married to a friend of ours. He's since come to his own conclusions and he's single again, because crazy is crazy.

I think you are going to have to decide what, if any, context you find her least inappropriate/most tolerable in. Taking the soft road, you could keep up the playdates, because children are usually a buffer, and decide how much you want to see her on those Mom's Nights. I myself value my 'extra' time and an evening out isn't to be squandered with someone like this. I've learned that the hard way. If you've already addessed this with the group and still want to continue going out but without her, a little discretion is necessary. Sometimes, too, not being available helps.

I hope you know there's nothing wrong with deciding not to continue a draining friendship. Many years ago, a dear friend told me that I needed to 'go talk to someone' because my problems were bleeding over into all of my relationships. It was very, very good advice, and because I followed it, we are still friends. It wasn't pleasant to hear, but I value the courage it took for her to say it.

I have two thoughts...one is you have to be a friend to have friends and the second is life is short...so finding a happy medium is important...it does not sound like you want to be in a position to say you do not want to have ANY interaction with this mom, but maybe limit it a little more. If you want a true fix, you could attempt to have a heart to heart with her...just tell her how you feel, she may be oblivious, and she is probably lonely. When you have a special needs child you are limited at times with who your circle of friends is, she may have no idea she has so dominated the group. I do not think you are a horrible person, we all have people we either click or do not click with. The whole asking about religious beliefs would have had me bristling...I feel like religion is a deeply personal issue...even with my own family...religion and politics are way off limits...helps to keep the peace.

I think that if the 4 of you would get together and plan in advance, you could get the point across that she needs to listen more. What if you agree that one of you will have had a rough week and when she starts to dominate that person could say something like, "Gina, I've had a rough week and this week I really need time to talk." Then the other 4 of you could keep the conversation flowing around that person. If she seems offended you could try and gently tell her that she usually talks about this or that and that the rest of you need equal time.

The problem that I see is that it sounds as if you want to get her out of the group and she'll feel extremely picked upon and ganged up on if she feels that it's 4 against 1. And you haven't really said that the 4 of you are interjecting into the conversation. It wouldn't be very nice or fair to just freeze her out without giving her some nudges in the right direction.

You've got some great advise here, I do think she's in the asbergers category. Don;t be afraid to offend her, the worst that could happen is she stops attending your MNO ! Look her in the eyes and say "It's my turn to talk" and then start talking. keep it light hearted and announce "anyone who want to talk about religion -raise your hand!" and hope no one but her does. or " Anyone who wants to admit their house (yard) is smaller than Gina's raise your hand" everyone can raise their hand and then you say OK we've settled that now lets move on.. Youre not doing her any favors in not calling her on her social awkwardness. In fact use the word awkward when it is called for.

She doesn't have just some minor personality flaws that we put up with in others b/c we all have some to one extent of the other. She has HUGE glaring personality flaws. She sounds horrible to be around. AT this point it is kind of crazy for you guys to keep including her when she has treated you so poorly. Really-MNOs are supposed to be for fun and not stress. So you are going to need to de-friend her. Stop including her in whatever you do. Its up to you if you want to tell her why. Personally, I wouldn't. She has some unchangeable flaws-like being a religious bigot and a snob. hopefully you guys can just easily glide away from her. If she does finally ask what is the deal I would personally use the religious discussion that she made you guys go through as the reason. And she is NOT a nice girl so please don't worry about how nice you are to her. Let her make friends at her church.

It sounds like that's her personality and even if you speak with her that will not change. You will probably have to decide to accept it or not include her in your activities.

Nothing good is going to come of talking to this woman, from what you have described. Just move on with the other Moms and schedule your MNO's on the downlow behind Gina's back. It sounds shady but it's realistically the only thing you can do to keep your sanity and still get those de-stressing MNO's.

This is a tough one.I don't think you should just kick her out.You could plan your MNO's on nights she's unaware of,etc...but in the end she'll figure it out and just be very hurt.It sounds like she really needs this group,non supporting husband,Autistic child,etc...and I think you are trying to be sensitive to that.I think you guys should talk to her.And I don't think you will even have to go about it in a way that seems negative towards her.
Maybe something like,Gina we are so very glad to have this Mom's group where WE can all take a breather from the home life and even vent to each other when we need to.And with that being said,I really need to vent about the week I've had.Just take the table while trying to be sensitive to her.It really sounds to me like she is laking self worth and confidence and therefore she feels the need to talk about how big her house is,how involved she is in church etc...I know it's alot easier said than done but I think you guys need to be more honest with her.Like we really don't want to talk about religion right now,lets talk about _______.Am I making sense?LOL.I think there comes a point that you guys need to stand up for yourselves as long as you go about it in a positive way.I think saying something positive about her before you tell her something you don't like will help.And if you go about it in the right way with the right attitude and she still gets offended there's not much you can do.Because although it seems she REALLY needs this group,it is also meant for the rest of you and the rest of you aren't getting anything out of it.Hopefully it will work out and you can all remain friends.