Once the crazies come out on either (or both) side of an issue, I tend to stop listening because all I hear is their white noise. I don't want the emotional side of why you think this movement important or stupid.
I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what this movement is because of all the emotion and peripheral noise from both sides.
Could one of you RATIONAL, impartial mamas please break down for me EXACTLY what the occupy movement is? What is their platform?
Reader's Digest it for me - on like a 3rd grade level.
I'd appreciate it.
Thank you guys very much for the info. The links were helpful. I guess what I can’t understand is why they are going after the 1% or wall street…. Because it seems to me that “this” is what you get in a capitalist society that is not regulated. The economy we have right now is the exact and absolute consequence of a capitalist society that is not regulated. This is a GOVERNMENT issue, not a wall street issue. Are there people on wall street who are evil? YES. But is wall street to blame for the state of our economy and the fact that we have a widening gap in economic status? Not the way I see it. This is a much bigger issue than just the 1% who have taken advantage of the way our economic policy is set up and have happened to have been successful, albeit sometimes at the expense of others. But, THIS is what happens when you have 2 political parties that can’t agree for the good of the people. This is what happens when you have a “democratic government” and a “capitalist economy”. Those 2 philosophies can’t co-exist because they aren’t compatible. Democracy is about the people. Capitalism is about the profit. Those two concepts are mutually exclusive. When you can’t (or don’t because your elected officials – on both sides - act like whiny pouty kindergarten babies) regulate capitalism, combined with the basic lack of personal ownership in our society today you get a crisis like the mortgage crisis. Were the banks bad? Yep. Bad Banks. Bad Bad Banks. But MOST (not all) of those homeowners took advantage of those ridiculous home loans that NEVER should have been offered. They KNEW they couldn’t afford that house, but they were able to get in on an arm, or a balloon, and they felt entitled to a nicer home for less money. Because capitalism breeds entitlement mentality – that’s the nature of the beast. We all think we DESERVE the American Dream. But that’s not what the American Dream is. It’s not about ensuring you “get it”. It’s only about ensuring you have the opportunity to try, regardless of your background or you ethnicity, or your age, or your ….. whatever. That’s it.
Tat2d~2~B~amuse I’m intrigued by your statement “You are not honestly asking this to get the WHY you are doing it to beat those up who have nothing left to do but fight for the basic things in life...Like eating. You want to allow people a thread to attack those who have nothing left."
I ACTUALLY AM HONESTLY ASKING TO GET TO THE WHY. If you notice in my question I said “noise from both sides” and “I want the actual platform”. You gave me about 3 sentences of general ideology – healthcare reform, education reform, tax reform and then you spewed a bunch of emotional rhetoric. YOUR post is actually what I was trying to avoid, because it just spews how you FEEL. I wanted facts. I wanted to know what the platform stood for, because when I went out and tried to find the answers I was having a hard time sorting through all the emotion without getting to the actual platform. I don’t have time for that, because I am a single parent and I work 2 jobs – part of which is to pay back my student loan that I took out to go back to school after being unemployed for 2 ½ years. I get it. I don't think 14 million unemployed Americans is just about laziness. It’s a MUCH bigger and more complex issue than that. But explain to me how WALL STREET has ANYTHING to do with healthcare reform, education reform or tax reform? THOSE ARE ISSUES FOR THE GOVERNMENT. I don’t disagree with their anger and I can’t really get a handle on what their goals and objectives are…. So then when I see posts that have no actual “content” and are primarily based in emotional rhetoric it gives a lack of credibility to the movement. I was trying to understand what the movement stands for – beyond and through the emotions of people who are desperate.
Again - thank you to everyone who answered with detail about the platform and purpose of this movement.
And Happy Thanksgiving.
I'm trying to keep it "Reader's Digest" simple.
The corporations in this country are BUYING legislation that favors them, not the citizens.
Simple enough?
ETA: Wow! From some of these responses it is crystal clear that people have a lot of opinions but, sadly, NO FACTS. PERIOD!
I honestly don't really understand it completely myself...
Although, I do have a comment pertaining to something Jo mentioned.
My husband got the robostamped foreclosure from BofA after they bought it from Countrywide. We were only 3wks past due when we got the 1st letter telling us they were beginning the process. 82 DAYS later, foreclosed and sold at auction. NOT EVEN 90 DAYS!!! This was after they'd explained over the phone [on Dec. 22nd] that they'd give him 90 days [during Christmas/New Years] to sell at appraised value. We posted it for WAY UNDER "appraised" value and no one even glanced at it. It was sold by the real estate company that purchased at auction for $15,000 less than what we had it listed for!!! So, a home valued @ $70,000, listed by us for $58,000, and sold for $39,900.
Point is though... Not everyone got even 90 days, let alone a year or more.
This group is trying to raise awareness in regard to a multitude of social justice issues. It doesn't look like any particular model I have seen up to this point, other than collective anarchy, which in itself is not a bad thing when used correctly. (This means decisions are made by group consensus. Discussions can be long and tedious, but I think often the members of a group are more satisfied with a decision because within the process; to reach consensus, all concerns must be heard.)
I remember that many people were pretty frustrated with the Tea Party at the beginning for this very reason. Rallies were happening (with some calls to arms, or more, from some individuals, if I remember correctly), but the supposed beauty of the Tea Party movement was that there was no codified message or organization. (although, we later learned, there was in the form of financial backing) Leaders did eventually emerge and were voted into office.
I'm feeling fairly rational and impartial this morning, and I think an earlier poster said it best:"The overriding theme is the increasing wealth gap". This factors into so many aspects of the sustainability of our country's middle class: health care, the bank bailouts which backfired, social programs, the environment... I don't want to bore you, but could go on. They are all entwined. The Keystone XI pipeline is one example of one of the causes under their umbrella: individual families were being threatened with losing their homes and farms and designated wildlife areas were threatened all due to 'eminent domain' laws that Canadian oil companies were preparing to exploit. This is one example of how so many of these issues are intertwined.
I think it is precisely because these issues are entwined that the Occupy group chooses to stand en masse instead of splintering off into smaller, more easily-dismissable groups. Although it is clear that plenty of people are dismissing them anyway.;)
Another thing to try is to look up what's going on with Occupy online. Go to the horse's mouth.
The overriding theme is the growing wealth gap.
There are various things it's about, and some protesters are just rabble rousing, but this is a great synopsis of the core issues:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8o3peQq79Q
Jo, it's funny your news station is only showing young, spoiled protesters. Sort of like a Rush Limbaugh quote I saw which had been super imposed onto a WWII veteran protesting. The RL quote said the protesters were spoiled wannabes who never did anything of value. There are all ages and types if you change the channel once in a while.
I want to offer a reason why it is so hard to get a clear answer. This is a grassroots initiative that is trying to do consensus building without any form of heirarchy. It is a painfully slow process that may or may not turn into anything concrete. It looks ridiculous but it could materialize. I suspect that an occupy movement in one city may do something of more significance and others will use it as a model. I worked in the nonprofit world and I find this approach painfully inefficient. However, it is truely the voice of American people. They don't have the political funding and structure like the Tea Party. At least they are doing something instead of staying at home and blogging about it. Democracy in action :)
Amy J's link is a comprehensive overview. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8o3peQq79Q
Most of the demonstrators have trouble giving voice to specifics, beyond the particular disadvantages and social inequities they have personally experienced, and the sense that those who determine economic policies in their corporations or our government do not understand the urgency of their struggles and losses.
For some, it's having been laid off after years of dedicated work so the company can shift more profits to stockholders and CEO salaries and bonuses.
For some, it's the exporting of jobs and whole industries in the name of profit.
For some, it's the loss of a family home because of the absurd decisions of some wealthy bankers, and laws that do not protect them from improper foreclosures.
For some, it's crippling student loans after graduating into a non-existent job market.
For some, it's watching loved ones suffer or die because their insurance companies denied care or medicine.
For some, it's paying much higher taxes for actual labor than a rich investor is taxed for profiting from an investment.
For some, it's because the actions of a few bankers, operating solely for profit and personal bonuses, have destroyed the housing market and hugely affected the stock market, to which many of our retirement accounts are tied. Workers who have saved carefully for years are suddenly faced with massively-diminished retirement resources.
For some, it's the fact that some cities' police are supporting the status quo and denying protesters the right to peaceful assembly.
But the inequities are everywhere, and we can see them if we look around with open eyes. And they are part of the same fabric of inequity, which the protesters rightly argue should not be what this country is about.
I will take a stab at one issue: access to higher education.
In order for a lower to middle class student to get a college education, most are taking on huge debt. They then graduate and have very little hope of getting a job, any job. Many of these young adults have solid degrees from great universities. So, no job with huge student loan debt creates a kind of despair. I know two twenty-somethings in my neighborhood who have great degrees. One is trying to substitute teach (which is competitive) while the other works part time at a nearby tourist attraction which will be closing down after the holidays. Try paying back $ 50,000 in loans on minimum wage and you see the problem. Oh and all the college students I know work their way through college, just as many of us did...except the cost is so high now, that they still end up with huge debts.
Then you add on to the fact that public universities are increasing tuition by huge percentages while at the same time cutting classes which means that many students have to take and pay for an extra year of coursework, and well, that is how you get UC Davis students sitting on the quad and eventually getting doused in pepper spray. These protestors may not improve higher education costs for themselves, but the way I see it, they might be helping my kids once they go to college. And for that reason, I completely support what they are doing.
