Dance Teacher Drama

If you're not going to participate... Sit out

Take a lap

...

There are 1000 variations of coach / instructor/ teacher/ etc. sidelining a student who is acting up or unprepared, so they aren't dragging everyone down. Its effective. HIGHLY effective. And used in every arena with kids. Including parenting.

Its just not called a time out (used to be, that's where we got the phrase from) in most sports anymore.

The 2 versions are sidelining, where the student has to sit and watch others play/work, or elsewhere, where the student is sent to the hallway, to run laps around the field, etc.

Sidelining is usually done for the Hmph! Ugh. Drag. Sniff. Out of sorts kid who is holding everyone else back. While the disruptive kid who is distracting or instigating trouble is sent away until they can calm down.

EVERYONE I have ever known has been told to either sit out or go elsewhere. Every parent I have ever known has had their kid have to do one or the other or both.

Its just part of working with kids. They get in trouble from time to time, and some more than others (my cousin, who's a footballer, was made an honorary member of the track team he ran so many laps).

It can also be a kindness (instead of a disciplinary action). I've missed classes, or been slow, and told to sit out this dance /act/etc. the point being to watch, so I know what's going on.

But its usually disciplinary.

From what I have seen and heard of dance teachers and what I know of Martial Arts instructors (I'm a black belt), I would never put my kids in dance. Dance is HARD work -- Martial Arts is HARD work but the difference of how to accomplish the task is approached so totally different it's like night and day. Martial Arts instructors come at the students with kindness and respect and work with them to teach them - - dance instructors insult and demean their students.
From just seeing the promos for that Lifetime series "Dance Moms" I see that instructor as a BULLY. And this woman is teaching others to be bullies, just what the world needs more bullies.

I answered your first question about your daughter and dance back in November, where she wanted to quit and you weren't sure if you should allow her to quit mid-way through the season...

Seeing how it has only been a month and a half since then, is it possible that the dance teacher has picked up on the fact that your daughter doesn't want to be there? Is it possible that the teacher was asking a legitimate question instead of throwing out an insult and embarrassing her on purpose?

I only ask that you consider this possibility before you go speak to the studio director...again...seeing how I think (if I recall correctly) that you have already spoken to the director once already, back in November?

~I am not trying to be critical here, only stating the obvious, but if I am remembering correctly about you speaking to the director before, I believe it was about the stretching teacher and now you will be speaking to the director about a different teacher? Just remember there is one common denominator in those two scenarios....and that is you (and your daughter)...might be worth thinking about BEFORE you go in all 'Momma Bear' with your claws out!

Is it possible your daughter still wants to quit and isn't giving her all during practice? Maybe you guys have come to the end of her competitive dance career?

Just something to consider?

~To answer your question: As an outsider looking in---and as someone who played competitive sports all my life and who has 6 boys who have played and are still playing EVERYTHING---the statements the teacher made to your daughter are perfectly OK, IMO. Teachers and Coaches are there to teach and coach kids who WANT to be there and who WANT to learn new techniques/plays/things and it's tough and sometimes frustrating when dealing with kids who do not want to be there or who are not paying attention or who are not giving 110%...not only is it frustrating but ultimately it can be distracting for the whole team! Now with that being said, we all know it's not so much *what* you say BUT *how* you say it!! I was not there to hear the tone? Tone would be the main factor to me, in deciding when and how much to bare the Momma Bear teeth! ;)

Good Luck Momma!

My .02 cents worth. take it or leave it.

Your daughter wanted to quit.
I think she still wants to quit.
When you want to quit something - it shows, and it's a stress to cover it up and act like you want to be there.
Her instructor is not fooled - she KNOWS your daughter wants to quit.
She effectively said if you don't want to be here it's ok if you leave.
I think this interest has run it's course and your daughter is done.
Find something else for her to do.
She might like dancing but hates the competition.
Or maybe she wants to take up figure skating.
Pointing out the time and money spent is YOU telling her that you've wasted them if she wants to quit - and it's not true.
It was fun while it lasted, but it's over now.
Realize when you are living vicariously through your child.
This competitive dance team means more to you than to your daughter.
Let her move on to something else.

Well as of six weeks ago (or so) your daughter wanted to quit and you didn't want her to.
No one is making your daughter do this, and no one is making you write the checks. My daughter is a gymnast, and her first gym/team ended up being too hardcore for her, so we switched to another gym.
This isn't public school, you actually get to CHOOSE where your daughter dances and/or competes.
If you don't like it, GO SOMEWHERE ELSE. It really is that easy!
This is America, we have choices!!!

You only have your daughter's side of what happened. You need to calm down and ask the instructor what happened before you accuse her of anything.

I can think of one obvious possibility and that is that she said something similar and your daughter was overly sensitive and read something different into what the teacher said. I could see the teacher trying to motivate your daughter and asking in a calm but direct manner if your daughter wanted to be in the dance. Especially if your daughter has reservations about taking dance, she will be defensive and hear this differently than it was intended.

This is competitive dance and it could be that your daughter isn't doing as well as she needs to do so that the team can win. Perhaps your daughter would be happier in regular dance classes without the competition. I suggest that at 11 she should be given the choice of what she wants to do. Forcing her to stay with something that she doesn't enjoy will only cause the teen years to be more difficult. She is older now and has been exposed to many other activities which she may find more enjoyable and less stressful. Let her have her childhood.

Always ask for the other person's viewpoint before making accusations.

After your SWH: Sounds like you want the competitive dance world to be different than what it is. You cannot change the larger world. You either have to accept the way it is and adjust or fight to make it different. When you make that decision you have to decide if your skin is tough enough to deal with the inevitable fight back reaction.

Sounds even more to me that this is not the right place in which you or your daughter need to be. You want kindness, all of the time. That is not going to happen. Just as others cut slack for you when you're upset and lash out, (I'm describing this event as seen by you.) you need to cut others slack too.

Is competitive dance important enough to you and your daughter to learn how to manage the negative aspects of it? Or is it time to move on to something less intense?

It sounds like your daughter may have not been working up to par or paying attention or something because that sounds like the words of a frustrated instructor trying to get her attention when other ways may not have worked. It sounds similar to the empty threat of many parents: "You knock that off!I brought you into this world and I can take you out of it!"

It's meant to sound imposing and snap you to attention. Ask your teacher what your daughter was doing to warrant such a response. You may find your daughter was not totally innocent and the reprimand didn't just come out of left field.

Sounds like a normal comment to me. My dance teacher would say that if kids were goofing off, being disrespectful, or clearly not practicing at home. It's a truthful statment. In competitive dance, your daughter has to want to be there - not you, grandma, dad, just her. And if her actions are indicating otherwise (by goofing off or not listening) than the teacher has every right to call her out on it.

I used to be a serious dancer... I also taught/assisted for a few years as an adult. My first thought when I read your question was - "What was the daughter doing when the teacher said that?"....meaning, was your daughter talking to a friend or goofing around/not paying attention while the teacher was demonstrating or teaching? If so, then it might not be too off base for the teacher to have said that.

Disrespectful of the teacher? Yes. But what was going on that caused the teacher to say that? Was she disrespectful by not paying attention?

When I was in college, in a college dance class, I was turned around looking at the bulletin board during class. I got REAMED! The teacher said something similar and almost kicked me out of class. I wasn't being disruptive, but I clearly was not paying attention and that pissed her off. A "serious" dancer in a commitment like a competitive squad needs to have utmost discipline at all times or they could certainly get kicked out. It is how the dance world works.

I have no doubt that your daughter is embarrassed and upset! I certainly was when the dance professor said what she did to me. When I was younger and we were talking and goofing around, we always got threatened to leave the room, not be in the dance, etc. It is a way of getting the girls to shape up and pay attention. If you want your daughter to be respected, you need to let her know that something she did was not appreciated by that teacher and she can't behave like that if she is serious about dancing with this group.

It wouldn't hurt to get the teacher's side of things...I wouldn't go in there like "mamma bear"...I would simply say "What happened? (daughter) was upset by being called out and I just want to know what happened so I can talk to her about what NOT to do in the future..."
Good luck...welcome to the dance world. It is a tough place to be...dancers are beautiful and delicate, but their skin needs to be as thick as the callouses on their feet in order to stay in it! :-)

Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with what she said, if your daughter is not trying her best, or copping an attitude. It's easy for kids to not give the whole story and try to get you on their side and play on your sympathy. I would talk to the instructor first, be reasonable and open to what she has to say rather than going in there guns a-blazin', ready to rip her a new one. And realize that maybe your daughter really doesn't want to do dance any longer, but feels she has no choice because you keep insisting on it, pushing her, and maybe even reminding her of the money and time you have spent so far. It doesn't matter how much money and time you guys have put into it - if she is done, she's done.

For a little perspective: I did marching band in high school. A friend of mine in band had parents that were very competitive and were always pushing her and pressuring her to be the best - she had to be first chair, she had to get top ratings at competitions, etc. Looking back, she realizes how stupid it all was. All that pressure - for what? It's not like we were preparing for a career in music! Neither one of us has picked up our clarinets since we graduated! It's not that we didn't enjoy it, but the point is that this was something meant to be enjoyed, to be done for fun, not be one more thing to stress out over. It just so happens we both work in the same vet practice now (I am a vet, she's a tech) and while we didn't become professional musicians, it wasn't a complete waste of time either. We got out of it what we got out of it (memories, friendships, a sense of achievement) and moved on.

A friend of ours has had her daughters in competitive gymnastics for years as kids - 20 hours a week in the gym, tournaments on weekends, the whole 9 yards. When the oldest hit middle school and decided she didn't want to do it any longer, that was it. Mom always said she never expected them to keep going if their heart wasn't in it. She doesn't consider it a waste of time or money that her daughter decided to stop. The younger daughter is still into it, the older one decided she wanted to do other things - she's been on her basketball and volleyball teams in high school and has enjoyed it immensely. The gymnastics gave her a good foundation for everything in her life (hard work, athleticism, etc.) but she was also getting burnt out. So maybe, what you should be doing to talking to your daughter more, and honestly trying to listen to her and what her feelings might be, and consider that she might be done with dance - at least for now. Maybe she just needs a break, maybe she wants to try something else, or somewhere else. She's only 11 for crying out loud - unless she totally loves competitive dance, is planning to do dance as a career or whatever, you have to ask yourself, what's really the point if she is not having fun?

I do not think its a particular bad statement. I think it depends on the context. Is this the first time, is there a pattern on picking on your daughter. Or is your daughter not getting the dance and the teacher is frustrated. I would file it away and keep an eye on the situation. Make surprise visits to the school during class etc. Talk to the other moms not about your situation. But just listen to their complaints and if they have the same complaints. But no the statement I think is pretty mild.

" do you want to be in this dance? Because if you don 't I have no problem with you not being in it."

This to me is a question for your daughter to answer honestly.

Dancing is competitive as it is.. To be on a Dance TEAM, means each and every person is important to the team..

So does she want to do this or not?

competitive sports are different than "all play" sports. Not all kids are cut out for cut throat competition. 11 is "middle school" which is when kids typically separate between those who will go an and excel in that sport in High School and those who want an activity that is not as competitive.

I didn't read your back story, but if that comment made your daughter embarrassed and upset to the point that she feels completely worthless then it tells me that she is not cut out for something highly competitive. That her personality is more geared toward something that is "all play" or even something where individual performance is not critical.

Your daughter is on a competitive team. I think the rules are a bit different.
You don't know exactly what was happening either. Was your daughter goofing off? Was she not doing her jumps the way her teacher knows she can? Was she not paying attention? Was she.....? Maybe the teacher was frustrated! "Hey, if you don't want to dance, you let me know. You don't have to be in it." Actually sounds pretty reasonable to me.
My kids, 7 and 10, both play soccer. The coach has been known to watch them on the field, lollygagging, and say, "Hey! Sebastian! You want to play? If not, off the field!"
And they play recreation.
She's 11. Plenty old enough to behave appropriately at class.
L.

My daughter is 9 and is also competitive, so I know 100% what you are talking about. Would I have liked the comment? Nope. Would I think there may be reason the teacher said it? Yep!

If all of the girls/guys on the team are not giving 100%, then it's not fair to the kids that are. Maybe if your daughter doesn't want to dance, you should find something else for her to do.

I would still talk to the director, we are close friends with ours, and find out what's going on.

I think you need more information to know if this was or was not inappropriate. You need to ask your daughter some more questions (what was happening prior to the question/comment? Had she been goofing or slacking off? Did something happen earlier and/or at a previous practice? Was it said only to her or to others too?). Then you need to ask to speak to the instructor privately and calmly ask if there was some kind of problem and find out what her side of things are.

My guess is would be that either your daughter and/or a few girls were acting up or slacking off and it prompted her to take a tough line to get them back on track. Another thought would be the instructor heard a complaint or comment and responded with that remark (maybe to one or maybe to several).

If you find that there really wasn't anything that prompted it, it was said to your daughter, and it seemed too much, then you have to ask the instructor if there is some problem you need to be aware of and go from there.

In todays society, most of the activities our children participate in are divided into two categories: recreational or competitive. Both of my kids have been in competitive activities including gymnastics, cheerleading and dance. To compete, you have to be polished and focused. It is a complete different level than recreational. My youngest was determined to play basketball, so we put her in a recreational league. It was fun, instructional and very laid back. It exposed her to the sport without hours and hours of practice and easy coaching. Was she cut out to learn more? No, and we didn't spend a fortune to find that out the hard way.

Sometimes, it is much harder on the parents to pull away from an activity than it is for the kids. Please take a look at ALL the cues your daughter is sending your way. She sounds like the increase in difficulty this year may be overwhelming her. Maybe a year away of competition and pure recreational dance is the answer. It would keep her involved in dance, but take some of the pressure off of her. I know how hard it is, I cried harder than my daughter when she pulled out of competitive gymnastics. We took a year sabbatical from ANYTHING with the word competition in it and she discovered something else she loved even more. Good luck!

I can honestly say that my grand kids dance teacher has NEVER said anything out of line with my grand kids. She has been totally correct in every statement she has ever said. She tells them honestly if they need to pay more attention and she tells them honestly when they deserved to be told they had worked their hineys off.

It is always a choice if someone wants to be in a particular performance or not. They may hate the music, not like the choreograph, all sorts of things. I have supported the kids so far in this because there are always several dances per class. Leaving one out is no big deal.

This Spring she'll be in 1 for Hip Hop, 1 for Ballet, 1 for tap, and 1 for the tumbling show team. I would love to not have 4 costumes to buy, 4 different extra practices to go to on each Saturday and each Sunday for the whole month of April and May up to their performances.

I know that I see a lot of girls her age making changes. They go through a period here where everything else in the world is more important. They want to hang out with their friends, they want to talk about boys all the time, it's a time when their bodies are really changing inside and they are getting all their adult body parts like fuller hips, fuller breasts, larger feet and hands and all their bones are just getting heavier. It can be the time when a girl will just flat out want to stop.

I truly think that just taking her every day is the way to go. I would visit with the teacher and say something like "Hi Miss Jane, Susie was telling me last night that you told her she didn't have to be in this particular dance, can you visit with me about what she was doing?". This puts the blame on the daughter which will make Miss Susie feel more like sharing if she's really having attitude issues with your daughter but just hasn't said anything to you because she respects you and doesn't want to upset you. Or she could just blurt it all out and tell you that you have a lazy child that can't dance....don't know her so I can only put it in words that I might hear from a dance teacher.

She is the only one who can tell you why she said that. Giving a child a choice is not a bad thing. Maybe she is realizing that your daughter is stagnating and being pushed past her limits. Maybe she was trying to motivate her and had been pushed past her own limits. You can't possibly know and figure this out if you don't visit with her with "her" feeling like you are listening to her.

I think that you are doing the right thing by taking your daughter to class and keeping her going. Many many many girls drop out of dance around this time then in a year or so come back and are so bad. They can't ever get back to the levels they were. By then they have realized they loved dance and I have heard it more than once where a kid asks their parents why in the world they let them quit dance. So I know she may not want to be there so many hours and do so many different competitions but in the long run if she decides to go to college she will pay her own way if she gets a scholarship for dance.

Hopping mad?
Momma Bear coming out?
Even if those are the exact words the teacher said (which you don't know because you weren't even there and it sounds like you haven't even spoken to the teacher) I don't see anything wrong with it.
Your daughter is 11 not 4.
This is a competitive team.
It sounds like your daughter DOESN'T want to be there, but since you won't let her quit she is acting out, secretly hoping that you will get mad enough to let her quit.
No one's forcing you to fork over the big bucks for this program that you find "highly inappropriate and totally unnecessary."
Let her try something else, if she truly loves dance she will come back to it, and be happy to be there and work hard.

I also read the earlier post when your child wanted to quit. Now it looks like maybe her desire to leave behind competitive dance is showing in classes. While I think kids should stick with things to a degree, that does not mean they have to stick with things that are making them miserable. These are 10 hours a week she could be doing something she wants to do, with people who are more constructive than this teacher. Your child's decreased interest and increased stress are now showing for the teachers to see, and this will not be the last hurtful comment.

Please consider getting her out of competitive dance. Why does dance have to be a competition? If she likes DANCE for its own sake, get her into a studio that does not do competitions. If she wants to take a break for the rest of the school year, that will not prevent her from starting fresh with a different studio next summer or next school year. And I mean a non-competitive studio. She may find that she loves dancing, but not competing. (Or she may find she's done with dancing for now -- can you handle that news if that's what happens, or are you as the mom invested emotionally in her being a dancer? I'm not being mean; I know myself how I would be disappointed if my daughter stopped dancing and I'd have to deal with those feelings without making her feel bad for wanting to move on.)

Your daughter sounds burned out. I'm an adult and I'd be burned out by an activity I had to do 10 hours a week that was a cause of stress rather than pleasure. This is not school; this is an optional activity, a choice. There are other optional activities. Locking her into competitive dance prevents her from being exposed to other things she might like better, dance or not.

As someone else noted -- ages 11-12 are when kids tend to either commit even more to activities or move away from activities they've done for a while and move on to new ones that fit their changing selves. This is normal, not some form of defeat for you or weakness in her.

My daughter, who is also 11, never got into competitive dance, though she dances seriously. Her teachers work them hard and can be tough as the stress of a show approaches, but they would not behave like this because there isn't some trophy on the line.

I can remember so many of those type comments when my daughter competed in dance. I would go ahead and let the director know that it was inappropriate.

If she is trying to push her, she should have you on board, therefore, you should have already known this was taking place.

My daughter wasn't rail thin, but by no means overweight. The instructor wanted to put her on some sort of diet powder stuff that she sold.

My younger daughter ice skates and so far I haven't had so many issues. She figure skates and plays hockey. The only thing I have run into is a little competition from the figure skating coaches toward the hockey coaches. However, not too bad.

I agree with Megan P. below. Her answer to you is perfect. The dance world is tough, and competitive dance teachers are hard and expect perfection and un-waivering attention and devotion to the art.

I would ask the teacher her version of what happened to warrant the comment. There are always 2 sides of a story. Meanwhile if your daughter wants to continue at this level, she needs to either grow some thick skin or realize that maybe this level of dance is not for her.

Best of luck!

She has been dancing now for almost half her lifetime perhaps it is time to move on to something more rewarding and fulfilling. Keeping her in this environment against her will isn't doing her any good.

To answer your questions specifically.
Yes you are being too sensitive but that is how great momma bears respond when their cub is under attack but by the same token you are being unreasonable. You have seemingly for good reason forced this child to stick to this but it isn't helping build her character in a positive way. She sounds too sensitive to take this kind of interaction which is fine she is only 11 and has time to develop a thicker skin.

No you shouldn't say anything to the director but pull your child out and give her the break or change she is asking for with any strings attached.

I think you should just calmly go to the teacher and ask her what she meant by that.

I hate negative "correction" because it always shut me down and made me feel embarrassed and like a failure.

I get where you are coming from. Kids sometimes need a break from an activity to remember they enjoy it, but competititve teams might not allow it. My d got burned out on karate and wants to go back. I am going to ask her teacher how much homework is coming before we commit.

I don't like that kind of coaching but it is very common these days. At 11 I think the teacher should have been kinder but I don't think that's going to change. anything competitive is going to be coached like that because of the pressure the coach feels and how they transfer that pressure.

I agree that in Martial Arts it's different. My son was very, very shy when he started tae kwon do. The teacher never told him he did anything wrong. He just showed him over and over what was right. It was a kind coaching that brought a shy kid out of his shell and became a catalyst for a confident childhood. Was the Master not a competitive person? Ha! Olympic Gold!
There are better ways of bring out the best in our kids.