4 Year Old Does Not Want to Be Told - No

No 4 year old, ever, wants to be told no. Most adults don't like to be told no either, but a 4 year old has a harder time controlling the reaction to it. Parents need to teach kids to deal with hearing no. It seems that spanking has not been an effective tool in teaching him, so why continue using it? It is up to the adults to find an effective method. There are many books and parenting classes available. He does need to learn that screaming, hollering and crying are not acceptable and will not result in him getting his way, but I suspect that hitting him probably only causes more screaming, hollering and crying.

No one likes to be told no - it doesn't matter how old you are.
But most kids by the age of 4 have learned some coping methods for how to deal with disappointments - major tantrum years are the terrible twos and terrible threes.
Once you get into 4 yrs old it can still happen from time to time but it shouldn't be as often as you are describing.
Not every kid has impulse control down yet and transitioning from one activity to another (playing with friends at the end of a school day to going home, or being dropped off for school in the morning, for example) often has kids crying for 10 min before they adjust and move forward.
It would be worth it to have the child evaluated for ADD, ADHD, etc.
IF he's got a medical issue, then he can't get his behavior under control and this is not something he will grow out of - he'll have behavioral difficulties all through school.
The adults in his life need some better methods for coping with his issues too rather than just spanking him when he pitches a fit.
It's not teaching him how to not have a tantrum - he just fears having one.

No child and No person likes to be told "no".
Who cares if he is an only child, that hold no bearing to this behavior.

Poor parenting is certainly part of the problem. Hopefully your daughter realizes that spanking is not working. You don't get respect from a child from hitting them.

It sounds like he is crying out for help. He needs a stable loving home. Get some counseling and parenting lessons for your daughter so she can learn how to raise a child.

A lot of children will "scream, holler and have a tamper (temper)" when they don't get their way and they know they can manipulate their parents, grandparents, teachers, etc.

he sounds like a sad and confused little fellow. he's referred to as 'spoiled' by his own grandma, who in the same breath says he's spanked and punished regularly.
so how is he spoiled?
he's four. i'll bet YOU don't like to be told no, but you want this pre-school age little boy, barely out of babyhood, to accept it maturely and wisely.
it sounds as if he's a very normal little boy whose very normal and natural outbursts are met with drama and excess. he doesn't sound like he has an emotional problem, just a need for calmness and quiet, for sensible reliable boundaries, and people in his life who are able to be the adults and hold a space for him to be a little boy and figure out how to handle natural disappointment.
khairete
S.

I would suggest she change her approach.

Spanking .. freaks kids out (especially if they are already in a tantrum/upset) because it's mom/dad losing their control - which is just bewildering to little people, and makes them feel very insecure. Think about it.

He's obviously seen/heard something (Shooting) that's a bit too old/inappropriate for him. Your daughter could use as a learning opportunity and just monitor ipad/tv use more, etc.

If he has a hard time transitioning, give him heads up. I had to do this with my oldest. He would think it wasn't fair that he was playing outside and had to come in. He didn't want to put on his pajamas. So I gave him a heads' up. I still do. Honestly - don't you like a little bit of warning? It works really well.

I used to remove the child (not toys, and no spanks) if a child was misbehaving. Once he calmed down and was well mannered again, THEN he was rewarded by coming back in to join us.

Sounds like she just needs to stop being reactive and be more proactive.

First off your daughter needs to stop spanking her child. All it teaches him is that its ok to hit to get your way. Not cool.

Yes 4 yr olds don't like to be told no. They don't have the vocabulary to really express themselves well so tantrums are their was of letting you know that they are unhappy that you are saying no. Your daughter needs to remain calm with her son and not over explain why he can't do something or have something he's asked for. She needs to be consistant.

My youngest is a MSW and usually the problem is the parents not the child.

Sounds like your daughter (and her husband if he's in the picture) could use some parenting advice and guidance. We can't tell what may be going on from what you wrote other than to say that spanking is not a very effective or thoughtful discipline tool and doesn't seem to be working for your grandson. My suggestion would be for them to talk to their pediatrician about their concerns and get a referral to a child psychologist. A few sessions with a trained counselor will help them to better understand what motivates his behavior and whether or not it's normal and age-appropriate and just needs to be handled more effectively or if there is something else going on that they need to consider.

Please don't call your grandson spoiled. Negative labels like that don't help anyone.

When you write that you don't know where he's getting it from, he's getting it from being 4. This is 4. I think he angry...if someone many times my size was hitting me whenever I didn't do things right, I'd be angry, too. He's threatening his teacher cause his teacher won't hit him, but I think that anger is coming from being hit at home by someone he loves.

He needs time, I think, with mom...and less time in front of a TV or an ipad. He needs someone to say: Let's do this, instead of that, which teaches him the right behavior, instead of just punishing him for the wrong behavior. He's 4, that's 48 months. I always think that if you can calculate a child's age in months, that's really just someone who needs tons of hugs and kisses, and tons of patience.

Instead of spanking, a great book is 1, 2, 3, Magic which our pediatrician recommends. Also, http://www.babycenter.com is wonderful.

Well, you can't raise a child to be afraid of being hit. Sorry, I don't buy it. And it's clearly not working. It teaches kids that it's okay to get so angry that you can't control yourself - and that's exactly what his problem is.

Your grandson is CLEARLY exposed to things you (and perhaps his parents) know nothing about. He's learning the "I'll shoot you" language somewhere. So, I'd ask first if his TV and computer game usage is being strictly monitored. I'd also ask who he's exposed to (family, close friends, neighborhood kids) who are teaching him this language and letting him figure out that it works.

And somehow, he's getting the idea that having a tantrum works. So, unless he has a major oppositional defiance disorder (and maybe he should be evaluated), he's finding, on some level, that tantrums and screaming work. The standard thing with a tantrum or screaming is to ignore it. That means, don't respond immediately by taking away things or, God forbid, spanking. It does mean, though, to pull the car over, park, and get out, leaving him screaming. Stand where he can see you so he doesn't feel totally abandoned or unsafe, but out of earshot. Tell him you'll get back in the car and start up the trip again when he stops screaming. Or, it can mean to stop dead in your tracks in a store, at home, or wherever, and tell him you cannot hear screaming or you cannot understand yelling, whatever words you use (but be consistent). It means putting him in his room, saying he can come out when he can be quiet and talk normally. If you're out, it means leaving the store, the park or the playdate if the first warning doesn't work, putting him in his carseat with a few terse words ("We don't scream. If you do, we go home.") and then NOT talking to him or engaging with him at all until he stops. Depriving him of attention defuses the situation, even though it's hell for a week or three until he gets the message.

I doubt very much that this is what your daughter is doing. If she is, however, and is doing so incredibly consistently (which I doubt, since she spanks), and if he's still out of control, then he needs to be evaluated.

A school cannot keep a child in a program if he makes threats. That's not acceptable language. But a school should also have people with some background in behavioral issues and early intervention (if he needs it - they should be able to tell). By the time your daughter gets to the school, it's way too late to punish the child for what he did. Consequences have to be immediate.

Some kids need a head's-up before they transition to a new activity. So if you walk in and say, "Clean up now, we're leaving," it sometimes gets a reaction. So a 5 minute warning, or a timer, or things like that can help. "When the timer goes off, we will start to clean up, and then we will do XYZ." If you tell a child this age that he needs to do X or he won't get Y on the weekend, that doesn't work. They can't defer like that, and they have little or no sense of time.

It doesn't sound like he's being spoiled. It doesn't sound like an emotional problem.

It sounds like inconsistent, ineffective parenting. No 2 year old, 4 year old, 6, 8, 12, 14 or 16 year old likes to be told no. No you can't have cupcakes for breakfast. No you can't stay out past 10 pm (or 5 pm or whatever). No you can't grab cookies off the grocery shelf and throw them in the cart. No you can't ride your bike without a helmet. No you can't... the list goes on. When they're 1 they pout adorably. When they're 2 they stomp. When they're 4 they make a scene in public. When they're 12 or 14 they tell you you're the worst parent in the world and they hate you and you're the only parent who doesn't let them do something or go somewhere or have something that EVERYONE else in the entire galaxy has or does or goes to. An effective parent knows the rules, stays consistent and calm, and communicates them clearly regardless of how much the child protests. The effective parent has sensible rules, not ridiculous ones that are just intended to exert power. The rules that make sense are there for safety, security, stability, consistency, and intended to help a child grow up to be a productive member of society, happy, polite, and independent.

Understand that first.

Then establish a new parenting strategy. Rules must be clear, simple, and consistent. For example, you can't say that a bike helmet is necessary but then one day say "oh, you're just going down the street - yes, you can skip the helmet this time". You get down on his eye level and calmly say "we are going to the grocery store. You will sit in the cart." You review everything on that iPad and those cartoons. Some seemingly innocent "kid" programming is incredibly disrespectful and parents are oblivious. "It's just a cartoon about a cute rooster" but it's filled with violence, defiance, and bullying. Peppa Pig is often criticized for negative influences despite its innocent appearance. Unrestricted unmonitored iPad activity can be really dangerous. Also, an effective parent never says things like "I'm leaving this store without you" or "if you don't behave I'm going to lock you in the trunk", even if they really don't mean it. It's surprising how often I hear parents make those kinds of threats. Kids hear it and repeat it. Also, monitor what tv shows are on when the kids are in the room. Mature-theme crime shows shouldn't be on during dinner, or when the kids are playing in the room.

When your grandson hollers and screams, do exactly what Diane B suggested. Ignored behavior will decrease, rewarded behavior will increase (and as I've said before, the rewards don't mean prizes and toys, they can mean a parent's attention, eye contact, interaction, chatting and otherwise paying attention to the child).

Please read up on child development and find out what is typical for four year olds.

In my opinion, his behavior is relatively typical. Spanking, however, is not going to curb the behavior. It sounds like he needs more positive interactions with adults and support in learning how to move through his feelings in a more appropriate way. What does this look like?

Mom, grandma, other adults: praise him for things he does right. Praise him for the times when he does kind things for others. Lots of hugs, gentle touch when he is busy doing something *he* likes to do which is not a problem for you. This is called 'being love', or " I love you just for being" and is a powerful, nonverbal way to give positive attention.

You state that he's 'doing things to get a spanking'. He's not wanting the spanking, he's wanting the attention of the adult and is risking receiving negative attention because he's not getting enough *positive* attention. This is normal. My son who is nine did this just the other night to 'test' whether I was paying attention to some actions I'd already asked him to correct. I let him know "I see you looking at me to see if I'm watching. I am. That's not a good way to get my attention. Give me that (item) and you may have it back when I can see you are going to follow my directions." I was able to tell him that I understood what his intentions were AND that I was in charge-- that I could hold the item until he was ready to comply with directions. No spanking necessary, no big eventful conflict.

Kids will do what they must to receive parent/adult attention. I suggest that if the adults start to give attention during NON-conflict times, some of this behavior will become unnecessary for him. Will he still misbehave? Of course. Kids are better off learning things in a logical way (rules of conduct) than being immediately shut down by being taught that mistakes are a reason to hit others. We don't hit people when we disagree with them or are angry with them or their behavior. If mom can control herself and her anger, then it is more likely that the child's behavior will improve.

That is such a challenging age! I'm a very emotional person, and I found it very hard to always remain calm. Looking back (and looking at some of the situations I now face with older kids) I realize that I always have the best results when I stay calm. If I can be very matter-of-fact and simply state, "I know you want to play, but it is time to go," one of the boys might protest or try to convince me to let him stay, but they will accept things much more quickly if I remain calm and stay consistent.

Your grandson isn't doing anything out of the ordinary for a 4 year old. And your daughter is really trying to deal with it and teach him. It's hard! It takes a lot of energy. Encourage her. Let her know that you are proud of her and how hard she is trying. Especially encourage her when she remains calm and consistent and doesn't give in.

When he throws a temper tantrum, calmly tell him what he needs to do. If he doesn't, take his hand and remove him from the situation.

Stay calm and consistent, and you will teach him. I have a son with special needs who is going to a different school. They have a very small student to teacher ratio, so they practice a lot of "wait it out." The principal said the best thing to me once. She said, "I only have to wait 1 more minute then he does." Patience! You will succeed.

No one likes to be told no. A 4 year old is still in the learning stages of how to deal with being told no...though he should be on the edge of being able to deal with it.

We are not anti-spanking in our house, but it is clearly not working for him. It should not be used as a punishment for a tantrum anyways.

Your daughter should take some parenting classes and figure out how to better help her son deal with life. He learned from SOMEWHERE to threaten someone with a gun if he didn't like the answer...huge red flag there and I'm glad the school called.

Spankings are not an efficient method of discipline. Obviously, they're not working.

He doesn't have an emotional problem, his parents do not know how to discipline him properly. Tell them to watch some episodes of Supernanny, for starters.

I've only spanked my kids twice...the first time when they threw themselves on the floor and had a tantrum and the second when they figured out how to open the front door and run down the street. That was the first and last time they every did those things.

You and his mom both need to figure out a consequence to his bad behavior and STICK TO IT. You also tell him ahead of time what you expect. Like, "we are going to get groceries and I'm not going to buy you anything so don't ask. If you are good and don't have a fit, you can have some extra tv time (or whatever) when we get home. If you aren't good, we are leaving and you'll go home and sit in a time out (or whatever)." That way he begins to know what YOU expect and if he doesn't do it, what will happen to him and if he does do it, he gets a little reward for it. You can use this practically for anything. I do this with my teens. For example, if either of them gets a detention at school, they will also lose their electronics at home for 3 days. So it makes it not worth it to them to get into trouble.

Maybe get Magic 1-2-3 or another parenting book that is easy to understand for that age group. But no matter what you do, you MUST follow through with what you tell him or he will know he can get away with it. Good luck.

The few times my girls carried on after being told no I just told them they were hurting my ears and sent them into the dining room to carry on as long as they would like. Without an audience they calmed down within a minute and came back to where ever I was for a hug.

No one likes the word "no". As a parent, you must learn what type of discipline works for your children. For my daughter all I had to do was use the "mom voice" and she towed the line. My son on the other hand could be beaten and he would say "that didn't hurt". Taking things away and being consistent worked with him. He too didn't like to be told what to do. He would tell me "you're not the boss of me". And I would firmly inform Mr. Know-it-all, that actually I was the boss of him and everyone else in the house!!!

Consistency is the main thing. My son didn't do well in "gray". He was and still is black and white. We did talk to a specialist on how to deal with him and consistency was our main focus. The boy could be exhausting but you have to stick to your guns and stay the course.

It took a couple of months (did I also mention he is stubborn?) for him to get that things were now a certain way and throwing a fit would not get him what he wanted. I would leave the room when he started and he'd just stopped and followed. If I went into another room, he would follow and start up again. I would get up and leave that room not engaging with him at all. I ignored him and his behavior. Again, I had to do that ALL THE TIME.

The grocery store was a certain punishment from hell for me with him!!! I remember one time, he is rolling on the floor, screaming his head off and I just looked down, stepped over him and kept going. I was so embarrassed and just wanted to pinch his head off, but that is illegal!!! The look on his face was priceless. I think that is when he got that I was not giving into him anymore. He would push the boundaries but for the most part he got it.

It does work! He graduated from college in May, has a job, and is getting married next year. He is a wonderful young man and I really enjoy being with him. Consistency is the key and finding they "coin" or what matters most to them.

Some kids are just harder than others. Some kids want to please adults and some don't. This is just a personality type. Some kids have a harder time not getting their way. Some kids have tantrums and some do not. He sounds like a normal 4 year old to me. My son was like this. My daughter was not. He is 12 now and is much more mature about things...but it took a long time for him to slowly mature and be more reasonable. He used to get so mad when he did not get what he wanted. We didn't give in. We did give consequences...he just was not ready to ever learn from those consequences. For two years we had him see a child therapist once a week so she could teach him more ways to deal with his extreme moods and behavior. This was helpful...we didn't do this until he was 9/10 though. I think it helped him to hear this from an adult that was not a parent. Our daughter has always been pretty good and easy...sure she sometimes needed a consequence but for her this was terrible and she was very contrite afterwards and then did not do the same thing over and over...in other words she learned quickly from her mistakes. It sounds to me like your grandson is a normal 4 year old who wants what he wants and has tantrums...this has little to do with being spoiled and a lot to do with his personality and maturity level. That is my opinion anyway. Kids like this are a lot more work. To be helpful don't be judgmental of your daughter's parenting. Don't take it personally when you are watching him and he has a tantrum and says mean/rude things. Just calmly give him consequences knowing it is going to take years for him to mature and all this to sink in.

I find it perfectly normal. Children will sometimes act up to get attention, even negative attention like a spanking. He is getting the "shoot you" phrase from somewhere, probably television. I think everyone involved needs to go to parenting classes and that includes you.

Heck I don't like being told no and I'm highly spoiled or well loved as my grandmother would have said.

However it is important to teach how to deal with disappointment. How to handle life's "NO'S".

Consistency over time will help the little one learn proper responses and how to deal with the limitations of life and living.