My Mom Thinks I Discipline Too Harshly...?!

I have to keep reminding my mother that I am the aprent. On the other hand, may I suggest that you use something else as punishment. If you use time with Nana she misses out and she also gets to pit you and Nana against each other. NOT A GOOD THING

E., I too am a Nana of 5 grandchildren and yes it's hard to stand back and not play the good guy but your Mothers actions are truly unacceptable. One of my daughters moved back home with my now 5 year old grandson so obviously I'm right in the thick of it. When my children started having children I vowed to myself and them that I would back off and only offer advise if asked and not be offended if they opted to not take the advise. And believe it or not it works.

No your discipline actions are right on the money. Taking away things/people that make there little world wonderful is a very constructive way to deal with her behavior. I've never believed in yelling or spanking etc. those disciplines are not producers of understanding consequences for unacceptable behavior. The earlier a child understands that they not the adults and manipulation is not going to work the better. I think your Mother could use some of the same discipline that you use on your daughter.

Being a grandparent is an honor and not a right of passage for your parent to create problems in your new family. My best advise for dealing with Mom is for you and your husband to sit down and have an honest and open conversation where you ask her to respect and support the disciplines that you hand down to YOUR children. Also you might remind her that once upon a time she walked in your shoes and ask how she would have dealt with the same situation, it might just open her eyes. If she finds this unacceptable and she's not willing to follow the rules you've set forth then she will have to accept the consequences of her actions.

Raising children is a tough job, I raised three, but fortunately stayed with what I thought was appropriate as discipline goes. You need to stay consistent with ALL of your children and Mom.

I hope for your sakes Mom will understand and support your endeavors of being a good parent. Good luck to all of you.

I do not think you were too harsh, she need to learn right from wrong. I have the same issues w/ my MIL. She is always underminding me & in front of my daughter.
Your Mom should not say anything unless you are abusing your children, which you are not doing.
I would tell her that you are the Mom & you need to give the punishment you & your husband feel she needs.
I don't know how many times I have told my MIL "I'm the Mom & I say no."

Dear E.,
I just wanted you to know that NO ONE on this board can judge you for your parenting skills since they have never met you. Throw away the insulting advice that your "harsh parenting skills" have caused your daughter's behavior problems. That is a complete and totally judgement on you and is not necessary.
I have had to take away priviledges with my MIL because my son's behaviour stemmed from time with grandma, it was a pattern that we observed over a long period of time. We have talked it out with my MIL and now she knows that there are boundaries. Things have been going very well now!
Ask your mom to back you up or back out of the discipline. You mom does need to respect you and not undermine you in the eyes of your daughter.
I would read "Dare to Discipline" by Dr. James Dobson. It is full of LOVING ways to discipline you kids.
Go to your trusted friends and ask them these questions. They actually know you and can can answer accurately.
It would seem that you have great love for your daughter and you are just trying to do your best, like all of us! :)

E.- I totally feel your pain! Reading your story was like reading my own! My mom and I don't exactly have the greatest relationship, but I put up with her for the sake of my kids. I too have a daughter-Emily(10) and son Tyler(8). My daughter, Emily was the first grandchild on my side of the family and has always been treated like a little princess. Tyler on the other hand who was the 2nd grandchild was always treated a little less special. The 2 of them are however VERY spoiled by my parents. They get whatever they want whenever they want it even if I tell my parents no.It drives me crazy! A couple of years ago my parents and I had a huge blow up over how I discipline the kids. Like you we started taking away things as a form of discipline. They have so much stuff from my parents that it didn't really phase them. One day we had enough and gutted all the toys out of their rooms. Some we just packed up and put in the basement so they could earn it back, but some we gave to charity. My mom threw a fit and we didn't end up talking for almost a year. I only made ammends with her so that my kids could have a relationship with their grandparents, but sometimes I wonder if I did the right thing. Just last weekend the kids stayed over night only to have Tyler call me up the next day crying and wanting to come home because Grandma was making him feel bad for missing us. I am also at my wits end! I haven't talked to her in over a week. That is about the only way that I can get through to her so she knows that I'm not happy with the way things go when the kids go over there. I guess that is my only suggestion for you is to maybe tell your mom that if she's not going to follow the same rules at her house then maybe you'll have to start limiting the time your kids spend with her. Hopefully it will work better for you than it does for me! If nothing else, this gave me a great opportunity to vent a little about my own situation! Thanks so much and good luck with everything! T. K

I think you are doing everything you need to. Your mother does need to realize taht you are the parent and if you feel your daughter is acting up and you decide to take away a privelage for her, you are doing what you feel is right. I don't think you are overreacting. I went through the same thing with my daughter when she was that age and even before. My parents thought I was stupid or something and constantly disagreed with the way I disciplined her. One time I threatened to not come back until they realized I was the parent and I may not be perfect but I have to learn on my own grounds and implement my beleifs and morals, not theirs! Eventually it stopped and they realized it's not their place to step in and "rescue" her all the time. It that happens, your daughter will not respect you and think Grandma will bail her out all the time. That can't happen! You mentioned your Mom wasn't around a lot when you were growign up and I think she may be trying to make it up by being there for your daughter. Sit down and talk to your Mom and state how you feel without yelling or judging. Hopefully you will be able to resolve this issue without damaging your relationship. Good luck!

Hi E.,

It helps to keep your relationship separate from one another. Who was being punished in this situation? Does a four year old understand punishment?

I highly recommend Greg Baer's book, Real Love in Parenting.

Don't be h*** o* anyone in your life, especially yourself! practice extreme self care and treat others as you want to be treated. Including your child and your parent. But mostly think about love in your life. Love flows out of love. Children need loving guidance and realistic boundaries.

You are also employed in a high stress job. What do you do just for you everyday? Give yourself lots of loving attention whenever possible.

call if you'd like a complimentary coaching session. You are a gift to everyone around you. coaching will help you remember your strengths, possibly discover new strengths and then SEE the strengths in the people around you.

best wishes,
K.
###-###-####
RevitalizeCoaching.com

Hi E.,

Sounds like you are doing the right thing to me....I think your Mom needs disciplined, too. I will never understand why grandparents let their grandchildren do things with them they aren't allowed to do at home...doesn't that just make it harder on everyone?!

Since you said your Mom wasn't around for alot of your childhood I would guess that maybe she is trying to make-up for that with your daughter, but totally in the wrong way. I know you have probably tried to talk with her about all of your feelings before, but maybe it is worth one more try...especially if she realizes Nana time might be cut short if your daughter's attitude doesn't change after spending time with her. Explain it to your daughter again, also. She might try harder, than your Mom, if she wants to spend time with Nana. It's a tough situation, but if EVERYONE will work at it, things can get alot better. My suggestion is to sit down and have a big family meeting. Put everything out on the table.

Good Luck!

C.

I think you are perfectly right in what you are doing. It beats a spanking, which people really frown on. My mother used to get really upset with my ex-husband about the disciplining. One day he told her, "You raised yours now let me raise mine and we will see who comes out on top." Needless to say, my mother never could tolerate him after that, but I did have children who totally behaved and were polite.

Your Mom is competeing with you. My Mom did the same thing she had to be the good guy. I told my Mom that I did not want my kids to eat certain cerals because they had too much salt and sugar in them and she would buy them and tell my kids to come there for breakfast and not tell me. She constantly underminded me gave the kids the impression that I dodn't know what I was talking about. Today my kids are all grown and I still have issues with them respecting me or the fact that I do know what I am talking about.
My advice, talk to your Mom. Tell her she has a choice, either she respects your decisions about the kids or she doesn't see them. I sincerely wish I would have moved at least 100 miles away from my Mom when my kids were little. She would not have had the chance to constantly undermine me. I know this sounds harsh but you are the parent and unless you are abusing or neglecting your kids your Mom needs to stay out of it.

Good for you for being firm and consistent with your daughter!! Teaching her about consequences of behavior is a really important thing that too many parents ignore. You are not being harsh or cruel or beating her or something. You laid out a consequence and followed through with it, even though it was not the easy thing to do, but it is a good lesson. My daughter had horrible tantrums and meltdowns as a young child, and we had to do exactly what you are doing. Some people call it "tough love" and it is very tough to do. For what it is worth, following through with those consequences (leaving a birthday party, missing a trip to a movie, etc.) was h*** o* the whole family, but it worked. We also had her apologize to others that were affected (for example, she had to apologize to my grandmother after having a meltdown with lots of bad behavior and having to be taken from the building at her 75th birthday party). My daughter is 13 now, and is growing up to be a fun, considerate, creative girl.
I have been lucky enough to be blessed with a great mom who has always been very good about respecting my wishes as a parent, even if she does not agree with them (she may discuss those disagreements with me, but never in front of my child - and I have to admit that a lot of the time she is right) but I have a SIL who is the opposite. She does not have any children, but is very judgemental about how everyone else handles theirs. My DH and I had a chat with my SIL at one point, and laid it on the line - if you can't be respectful of us as parents we cannot allow our child to be left in your care, even for "fun outings" and such. My daughter does not spend any time alone with her.

It's hard when our own mom's don't agree with some of the parenting choices we make. (I know from experience, too.) The bottome line, though, is that these are your kids, not hers, and she needs to respect your choices. If she continues to argue with you or not listen then feel free to cut the conversation short (because you don't need to go round and round with your mom when she's not listening). Stick to your guns!

E.,

I want to first commend you on sticking to our guns. That has got to be, in my mind, one of the hardest things to do. But starting now will make things much easier in the future. Your daughter will trust and respect you and know that what you say you will stick to. As for your mother, I would tell her that in order for you to have respect and tech your daughter things you wish her to learn, she needs to repect your judgement about it. If your daughter wasn't behaving nicely, then those are some of the possible consequences. I know my mom doesn't always agree with me. But I think we had a better relationship then you and your mom. It will be hard, but stick to it and I think in the end it will turn out right. I also believe here is a line in being fair in discipline and going too far. We do need to let the kids be kids. But you will need to be the judge of what s fair and what might be too much. But, if you say 'keep that up or this will happen', makes sure you stick to what you say! Good luck!

A.

I have had a similar situation with my mother in law.
My daughter was acting up and was warned and when she didn't listen I told her she was not going with Grandma out to eat and then to sleep over. I want my daughter to know that if I say something I mean it. I think you did the right thing. If we aren't firm now they will walk all over us later.

I think Grandma's forget how they disciplined. My husbands stories are drastically different than my mother in law's. Grandparents do have a special relationship. Just stand firm and keep doing what you are doing. Explain politely to your mother why and just leave it at that. She may not agree with you, but she doesn't have to. Eventually she will accept it and hopefully your daughter will have learned and you won't have to use that too often. Not being able to go out with Grandma left a huge impression and we haven't had to use that since.

I see the situation seems to be resolving itself, but I did want to offer one piece of advice that we've tried implementing with my little sister (she's 13 yrs younger than me).

When she had behavioral issues her parents tried taking visits with me away and instead I talked them into still letting her visit, BUT when she was at my house we didn't do the fun activities that were planned. Instead maybe we cleaned or did yard work or even sat and talked about the behavior.

Maybe try talking with your Mom and get her on board with your new disciplin. If you daughter respects her Nana she may start to realize that it isn't just her "mean" parents who are disappointed by her behavior.

One final thing to watch for -- make sure your mother doesn't undermine your efforts by saying things to your daughter that imply that she did not agree with the punishment. My grandmother did this with me when my stepmom and I were having problems when I was that age and it only made things worse for everyone.

Good Luck.

Hi E.,

My advice is to go with your gut. You are the mom, she is the child, and your mom is the grandma. You ultimately are the one responsible for the way your child develops, who she is as a person, and you are the one who spends the majority of the time with your child. Don't let your moms "advice" sway you from your parenting choices.

Good luck!

A.

You are absolutely right! As long as it isn't taking away a day with someone who is rarely around and would have to make a special trip to get there.
I would also tell your mom that if she allows the behavior that is against your rules and your daughter comes home with an attitude again, the time between outings will become longer. I'd even suggest to your mom that your daughter is obviously not mature enough to handle these special outings with Nana because she comes home just horrid.

Does Nana do special outings with her other grandchildren? If not, I would suggest that you don't allow it if she isn't going to make it fair. Starting a sibling rivalry this early is not good. I know your 2yo won't notice exactly yet, but even Nana taking just him out to the gas station for a slushie and coming right back will be something. Not too long for either of them, but enough that your dd will see that Nana loves everyone, and bring her attitude down a notch.

I can relate to your situation. I have been questioned by both my mother and mother-in-law. Mostly, it comes down to boundries and respect (or a lack thereof). One example, in particular, comes to mind.

I was in Florida with my two daughters (at the time one was almost 5, the other was almost 2). I was seven months pregnant. My sister and her fiance and my mother were also there. In our first two outings to the pool, my oldest daughter (who is very strong willed) showed absolutely outrageous behavior. To make a long story short, I started out trying to be very understanding and patient but when she started to run away when we were leaving the pool, I knew I had to be more firm. (I just couldn't chase her and her sister with my big ol' pregnant belly in 90 degree heat!) I told her if she didn't come with us to the car right away, she wouldn't be able to go with her g'ma and aunt to a Disney thing that night. Well, she didn't come and I had to carry her, kicking and screaming, to the car and then she screamed all the way back to the condo. When it was time to leave for the Disney event, I wouldn't let her go. My sister and mom thought I was being way too severe but I knew I couldn't back down or the entire trip would've been spent fighting my daughter. My daughter cried herself to sleep that night, and I felt awful, but you know what? The rest of the trip was awesome. She listened the first time I said something nearly all of the time. And we all had a blast the day we went to the Magic Kingdom (something I was dreading). My mom wouldn't admit that I was right, but she was impressed by the change in my daughter's behavior.

We also have trouble with the other g'ma and overnights. My daughter comes home high-strung and sassy every time. I sort of put up with it when she was younger, but now I have two other girls and just don't have the patience for it. One day I actually called my mother-in-law in tears and said, as gently as I could, that I really needed her to listen to us more about bedtime, too much soda, and letting her always get her way. Things have gotten much better since but she tells everyone repeatedly that grandmas are for spoiling and I don't think she believes how naughty our daughter is after one of her g'ma visits.

Well, sorry for the long response. In a nutshell, you and your husband know your daughter best and you have the responsibility of raising a kind and respectful woman. I think extended family is VERY important, but I'm all for extreme measures if sincere communication isn't working. It sounds like you and your husband are on the same page, which is very important, and also like you're actually trying to do some teaching about behaviors and consequences. Best of luck!

R.

Oh I feel your pain. My daughter just turned 4 at the end of June and I'm tellin ya, this is a crazy age with girls. She doesn't care what you do for punishment. We've tried spanking (no more), time-outs (no more), taking away toys (still trying), and we are also at the point where outings are out the window. Like your daughter, mine has a special relationship with her Nana, my husbands mom. When our daughter has plans and her behavior totally sucks she's not allowed to go. This includes her Bible school and swim lessons. These are the things she really cares about, and she knows that we're serious when we tell her that she's not going to be able to go if she keeps up her attitude. She whines and crys and throws fits, but we tell her that if she doesn't listen to mommy and daddy at home, then how can we trust her to listen to the grown ups at her activities? I don't think you're too harsh, I think that you've found some thing that works. As far as your mother is concerned, you might have to be blunt and just tell her, I appreciate what you're trying to do, but she's my child, not yours, and I will raise her as I see fit. If she doesn't get the hint from that I'm not sure how much more simply you can put it. Good luck. :)

My comments are these: I don't think you were overdisciplining or overreacting. Your mom might be trying to be the good guy, but I rather suspect she is doing what my own mother does- spoiling the heck out of her grandkids because it's fun to do it! I have had to put my mom in her place a few times- but I try to reserve these times for when I see a safety issue at stake: No, mom, you may NOT feed my 2 yr old candy- that's a choking hazard. etc. I try to let the rest of it go. I'm really not sure what to do about the attitude except to remind your child that no matter what she is allowed to do at Nana's, there are rules and expectations at home that must be followed- and consequences for not following them. I also think taking away the day with Nana wasn't out of line, but I think your mom probably was just overreacting to the punishment because it punishes HER too (which may be appropriate if your daughter's behavior is coming from time spent with her!) You sound like a good mom- stick to your guns and don't let your mom dictate how you raise your child. She had her chance with you. YOU are the parent, YOU make the decisions. Having said that, I will also add that if it were me in your shoes, I would choose a few specific things that your mom does that causes this attitude in your daughter, and insist that she change them. Tell her why you are asking her to do this and if she does not change, you may need to limit her time spent with your daughter until you can get the attitude under control. When she starts going to school, that may help, as there are a lot of expectations that are usually pretty well enforced at school; she may begin to learn more self-control at that point.

Hope that helps- I'm not an expert, just muddling through like everybody else :)

It's hard to say if you are over disiplining without knowing what she did or didn't do to diserve the punishment. However, that doesn't mean that others should tell you what to do. I have the opposite problem. My mother-in-law thinks we spoil our 4 month old because we don't let her cry it out.

I have read in several places that the best way to handle this is to say "thank you for the suggestion". You are the parent and you should be confident in your parenting. I wouldn't insult your mother by telling her you don't respect her parenting beliefs because that could make problems worse. She might purposly try to sabatogh your disapline.

I think she is trying to be the "good guy". Most grandparents will let grand kids do things they never would have let their own children do. It is possible, too, that she is trying to make up for not being there for you by being what she feels is a good grandma.

Maybe you need to limit visits with grandma because of the bad additude she comes home with. Explain this (in a nice way) to Nana. Explain that if she reinforced some of your rules she could get more time with her.

Hi, E.!
I just wanted to share that almost all grandparents over indulge and do not do disciplining. It is not her place to yell at you about what you do or say with your child, but when she is with grandma it is about fun and you can not expect her to keep up with your parenting expectations at her house. My mom goes over my head all the time:) She will give the kids a dollar to go play games at a restuarant when I just got done telling them to finish there food first. Or she'll let them stay up late and watch the rest of their movies when they stay over when she knows we have a strict bedtime of 9 oclock at our house. Or Mike's mom was just here staying with us last week, and we do not let our daughter have milk or juice after supper if she refused to eat her dinner, but his mom went and gave her a half a cup of milk to stop her tantrum she was having. Grandmas can get away with that though. I do not get mad about whatever they do. I just stick to my own guns at home, stay consistant, and am grateful that my kids have a great relationship with our parents. I would rethink taking time away from grandma, instead find something else that would be hard to give up. For my 10 year old it is taking away TV and video games for 2 weeks. For my four year old, he could care less about losing things, so he gets put in his room, and if he is really acting terribly he gets a spanking. When he is ready to apoligize and settle down he can come back out. My 3 year old, I just pick up, carry her to her bed, and shut ehr door, as the handle is hard to turn and she can not get out without help. Once she has stopped screaming or kicking the walls, I go in and ask her if she is ready to be a good girl and then let her come back out. I realize you may have a lot of resentment for your mom, but I would not listen to her when she doesn't agree with your punishments, but don't worry when your daughter is with her. You will never change your mother. So I wouldn't even try. And your daughter should get to spend time with her even if you do not have a good relationship with her. I hope this helped you a little.

I don't think it's too harsh. She hopefully learned a good lesson and will behave better in the future. I'm a very strict parent and I told my Mom a long time ago that they are my kids and she's not the Mom. I don't want her opinion on my parenting so don't give it to me. I also told her that my husband and I agree on our parenting and that's how it is.
I have alot of kids and in order to keep things running smoothly around here I need to be strict and my kids know it. When Mom or Dad say something they mean business and the kids know that. Do it or get in trouble.
There's nothing wrong with expecting a child to listen. That's the problem with today's society. To many parents letting the kids run the show and then they don't learn to listen to authority. I see it all the time. Laws and rules are just suggestions and I'll do what I want because I have a say - just like I did with Mom and Dad. I'll argue with the teachers and argue with the cops because I don't agree with them and hey, that's how I get my way with Mom and Dad.
Stick to your guns, you'll raise a much more well behaved child for it.
J.
Mom to 4, soon 5 through another adoption and hopefully more :o)

Mom, I'm sorry that you don't approve of the way (husband's name) and I have chosen to discipline our children. They are our children, and we have the right as their parents to discipline them in the way we see fit. As their grandmother, you are making it more difficult than it needs to be. You need to either support our decisions, or risk alienating yourself from our family. Your choice. and then stick to your guns.

this is definatly one of the hardest questions i have ever heard, and something that im struggling to understand myself. i realize at this point there isnt really anything to complain about except my mother in law wanting to be with her grandson, but every time i feel like shes forcing stuff on him, forcing him to play a certain way, with a certain toy, or with her... shes constantly making comments about being "chopped liver" when he wont pay direct attention to her all the time... its so annoying! but really is it hurting my son? no. should i say something sometimes? i mean, besides the above, there are things she does personally to my husband and i that are out of line and rude - like saying "well we never get to see brody" when we say that we arent coming over or something.

its very very hard when its family. you do have to choose when and if you are going to say something. however, in your situation i think you do need to say something.

if you could just sit down with your mom and tell her calmly that she needs to follow some simple rules with your daughter, and she needs to back up your punishments without making comments to your daughter. after all, YOU are mom of your little girl (and boy) and YOUR say is the one that matters. if you decide the punishment was to stay home from grandmas, then thats the way it is and your mother hasnt a right to say anything about it. tell her you would appreciate she back you up, even if she disagrees. she can talk to you later and offer her kind suggestions but she cant undermine your decisions.

does that make sense? its SO HARD to have to stand up to your family that way, but the sooner the better. it would be best to have this conversation when your children are not around so that you can concentrate on the conversation. dont get caught up in any arguements she may make, you might have to end the conversation if she starts getting emotional and upset or something.
but she needs to know that you do love her and you do want her to be a part of your children's lives, but you would appreciate it if she backed up your parenting, instead of critisizing, if she supported you instead of nagging to do it a different way. you are mom you know best right now. she can suggest things until shes blue in the face, that doesnt mean that you have to do it!

anyway. this was a long response. good luck and maybe if you are the praying kind, pray about it.

Yikes. It sounds like you're in a really tough spot. It must be very stressful, and I just wanted to give you my support.

The only advice I can think of is to keep your mother separate from discipline -- what I mean is, don't use canceling a visit to Nana as a consequence for bad behavior, use something else. The more you can keep your mother disconnected from your daughter's discipline, the better, don't you think?

hi...I am chiming in here as a grandma. I to have a unique relationship with my oldest granddaughter although I love all of my grand kids.
I have four children, my daughter is the 2nd in line and started early with her kids. My daughter always had to push my buttons growing up and spent many of her teen years grounded. I was told often that we are similar and although I don;t know if this is true, we do seem to have similarities in some areas that I will admit to.
My daughter hasn't always been the most patient parent and does tend to yell more than I can remember I did, although she is not physical.
I always tried hard to keep my mouth shut, to leave things alone when I didn't think she was being fair in her choice of punishment but the one time I said something I was told that it was difficult for her to love me because I don't allow her to do what she feel necessary to punish her children. My eldest granddaughter is almost 16. On Easter she showed up at my door without me knowing she was coming crying her eyes out. She finally calmed down enough to let me know the problem. I immediately called my daughter several times with no response. I did something I never should have done and that was to e-mail her that I thought it was cruel of her to leave her eldest child at home alone on a holiday-yes, it was a holiday and the rest of the family went to a swim party. I was never that blunt before and the response I received was I am sure her way of hurting me saying that I never support her parenting style and that even though she loves me I make it difficult to do. She did call me using my granddaughters cell telling me that I was not able to see my grandchildren unless I called and made arrangements with their father and that I would be taken off of the emergency cards. Mind you I watched these kids for free while I was on medical leave from my job so that my daughter didn't have to pay childcare costs. My daughter didn't call me for mothers day nor has she spoken to me since but to ask for things, to watch the kids and take them to camp during the summer. She uses the kids to get to me saying they are looking forward to doing things with me but I am so hurt, so crushed that she would be cruel enough to not call me for mothers day...I would have even taken a text over nothing. OK sorry, I was trying to answer your question and I rambled on about my issues....
I believe you were totally correct in not allowing your daughter to go with your mom if she was being punished for acting out, your mom should have backed you up on that. I think being a parent is one hard job. Being a grandparent is all about fun and love unconditionally with none of the headaches a parent has for discipline. Your mother should always back you up on any decision you make about your child s discipline at your home (which I did with this one exception) but when they are away at grandmas there is a whole different feeling. It isn't that we as parents do not trust that you are making the correct decisions on your child's behalf on a day to day basis, it's that while they are with us it's different. In my case my daughter didn't want anything from me regarding my take on her parenting when it came to discipline so I always kept my mouth shut, well until I didn't. My granddaughter and her mother are just fine where this has just about destroyed the relationship I did have with my daughter-I don't think your daughter truly understands the amount of power she holds over both you and your mom....even at such a young age.
I don't know if this helps at all....I really wish you well on this it's very painful to loose your child's love.

My daughter and 3 grandsons live with me and we try really hard to agree on dissaplinary tactics. Before they moved in if she had to break a visit or outing with one of the boys I may have been dissapointed but I understand that unexceptable behaviors have consequences. When my daughter was younger I would tell her what the options were once and then if the behavior continued I would follow through with the consequence. You and your husband are in charge of raising your child, giving her what she needs to grow in health as well as socially and emotionally. Stick to the rules you and your husband have made. Maybe having a talk with your mom and letting her know that the disregard for your rules are making life harder for your daughter's emotional health. I know it doesn't make your life any easier but maybe by putting the effect it has on your daughter first she will be more sensitive and thoughtful. If not, then you have to decide how you are going to handle the situation and with the support of each other as a couple and stick to it.
Sorry I don't have a magic cure all. Just be strong and rememeber you are trying to make life better for your children than maybe you had it. Consistancy and love along with healthy dissapline are good gifts to give to your children.

Your mom was disappointed in losing her outting with the granddaughter... as a grandma myself, I can understand that and wouldn't like to be part of the punishment with my granddaughter. You made that threat though and not to follow it through would do more damage then missing the outting so you did the right thing as far as following through.

About your mom and the difference between your son and your daughter. She has more in common with your daughter. She doesn't love her more, I am sure, she just gets to know her better with the same interests. I would be watching it though and make sure she has special days with your son also. My in laws took both the kids, grandma would have a special day with my daughter while grandpa would have it with my son. They are all very close to this day.

No offense, but I think your mom is acting just about as maturely as your daughter. You are Natalee's mom, and she is not. Of course Grandma is important in the family... but it is more important that you are there for your daughter (raise her with accountability and behavior guide-lines) than it is for you to make your mom happy!

Bottom-line is, you and your husband get to make the decisions. You know your daughter better than anyone else. It doesn't sound like you are over-disciplining to me, so I would say have confidence in your parenting skills and draw the line where ever you see fit!

(p.s.-I also came from a family where one parent was often absent, and I realized that alot of my adult decisions came from a need to be accepted and loved by the absent parent even though their behavior was their fault, not mine... but kids don't understand that and it was baggage I was still carrying. This parent, like your mother, also latched on to the first girl grandchild, I think in part to 'fix the past' they are guilty about. I don't know if this is your story, but realizing what was going on beneath the surface helped me to make better decisions in life, feel more self-confident, and draw better boundaries with others.)

I think your punishment was appropriate especially because the outing was for shopping. I am lucky. My mom is really supportive of me, and my daughter will behave in order to go to visit my mom. I will ask my daughter when she does something wrong, "What would Grandma think of that behavior?" My daughter will say something like, "She won't let me come to her house if I behave like that." Mind you my mom has never disciplined my daughter. She just has her respect mostly because I respect my mom. I know you have a really different relationship with your mother and I feel bad for you, especially because one of the ways my daughter has learned how to treat me is by watching how I treat my mother. When I jump up to do something right away after my mom asks me to and say, "Yes, Ma'am," I have more cooperation at home from my daughter and even hear, "Yes Ma'am," coming out of her mouth. This weekend when we came home from seeing my mom, my daughter said to me proudly, "I'm Grandma's good girl." Believe me my daughter has some emotionally trying moments, but at least I know she's trying to be good for someone, even if it's not for me all the time.

You should continue to discipline your child when behavior is unacceptable however you might want to be more creative with how you discipline. By taking away a day with Nana you not only punished your daughter but you punished Nana who may have been looking forward to the day she already had planned. Next time continue to use discipline but look for some other privilege to take away from your daughter.

Good for you!! I think discipline is important and they understand the warnings at all ages. The only advice I have is as caution - don't use people as your discipline methods as you are also hurting your mom by not allowing her to see her granddaughter. However, if she isn't going to back you on your discipline than I totally understand why. At some point you may just need to tell your mom that she raised you as a Strong Woman and you appreciate it so much but now it is your turn to raise your children and you will make mistakes along the way but they are your mistakes to make. Remind her that her role is to be grandma to all your children and that though she may not agree with your parenting style it is still your style and you hope that she will respect your discipline choices.
It probably isn't worth the argument to tell you that you don't respect 100% of her parenting beliefs. Just say you are happy with the way you were raised and who you have become.

You were right to stand your ground. You might want to reconsider what you use as "the stick" next time, though. Unacceptable behavior is never to be tolerated, but did it have to be a visit with Grandma that was the point of punishment? Your situation with your mom colors your view and if you see problems whenever your child comes home from a visit with her, you may be on the watch for opportunity to curtail their interactions. That's fine, but be sure you are not using your child's misbehavior as an excuse not to spend time with Grandma. If she truly was so out of control that no outing that day was reasonable, then stick to your guns! But if you are subconsciously avoiding time with Grandma, watch out. Your mom may recognize this. Her outburst to you was inappropriate, but we also don't know how much she was looking forward to the visit, what she had planned or her ability to set aside her personal wishes for the benefit of others (in this case the discipline of her granddaughter). If your mom has less than adequate personal self discipline and boundaries, it would explain why she got so upset and questioned your authority. Stand firm, be kind and respect her position as your mom and as the Grandma, even if you don't agree with her tactics. She demands respect for her position, if not her person. But she must also learn to respect your position as the Mom and step back to allow you to parent. Extend an olive branch by accepting her input and agreeing to consider it, but you don't have to agree to put into practice all that she offers. In return, she can offer input (politely) but you are not obligated to do everything she suggests. At one point I had to remind my mom very firmly that I was the mother of these kids and that God gave them to me! As much as I knew she loved them, they were my responsibility first and I loved them more than anyone else but God himself! That brought her up short and she realized I was willing to confront her poor behavioral tactics without undermining her position as Grandma. From that point on we had a much more agreeable relationship concerning the grandkids.

SAHM of seven

I think it's a 4-year old thing (the behavior!) Our daughter "cycles" between almost completely obedient and complete brat (not easy to say about your own child!)
Stick to your guns!! Time-outs are only partially effective for our daughter. When we started putting her "My Little Ponies" in time-outs (or "worse" yet, her very favorite teddy bear or blanket), boy did things change. I"m sure you will read many responses about consistency and follow-through of your threats. Some may say your punishment was too harsh (and maybe it was, but I wasn't there!), but you gave her a warning, and she didn't behave. YOU followed-through!!! That's what you need to do. I guess the only question is did you know that your mom had a "special" outing planned and did your daughter know thre was an outing, or was it just another day with Nana as far as she knew? And if so, then perhaps a different punishment should have been chosen. When the air clears, I would just tell your mom the issues and the strategy is that you and your husband have chosen and that EVERYBODY needs to be consistent with rules and consequences for it to work. If necessary, write it down and keep a copy at home and at Nana's (simple rules, of course). Good Luck! We have some similar issues, but mostly with the amount and types of cartoons my MIL let's our daughter watch on the day she watches her. I'll be piggy backing your post for insight as well, b/c I have found 3 and 4 years old to be far more challenging than 2 years old! Again, stick to CONSISTENCY and FOLLOW-THROUGH!

If you made rules then I applaud you for sticking with them because alot of parents dont and end up with brats.

Your mom is just going to have to realize that you need to nip your daughter's behavior NOW and that to bad so sad letting Gramma take her out would do nothing but encourage naughty behavior.

Gramma also can't spoil her and shower her with attention after she's been so naughty your just out to be the mean horrible mom even worse. Gramma should sit down with your daughter and tell her she's disappointed in her as well. That works wonders with my daughter when ppl outside our household tell her how sad they are that my daughter disrespected me or didn't listen to mom.

If your mom favors your daughter over your son your going to have major issues later on. I realy really hate when adults favor one child over another.

I know my daughter has a attitude alot too and OMG it's so frustrating but what works the best is sticking to your guns if you said NO, then stick with it.

Hi E.,

Good for you for sticking with the punishment you told your daughter was coming if she misbehaved. All too often parents say things and don't follow through. My kids aren't as old as yours, so I haven't had to deal with taking away family outings. I am not sure what I would do in that case. But my first reaction is, if your mom gets to see her often and your daughter really likes to do that then take it away if that's what you feel is appropriate. (I think if nana doesn't get to see her much, I would rethink it, but also I think 4 is an ok age to see that result from her actions).

As for nana spoiling her...we have that problem here too...from both sides of grandparents....We notice when we need my mother in law or my mom for babysitting - especially when we hit a patch of timing where we need them more often- my oldest gets demanding and throws fits more when he's at home. All the more important for DH and I to stick firm with the home rules....it usually takes a few days, but he comes back to his "norm". We have resolved that that's just the way it's going to be, since we can't monitor the grandparents 100% of the time and they feel it's a grandparent's right to spoil the kids. They know our rules and for the most part follow them. It's just things like extra snacks and giving the kids what ever they ask for that they do for the most part. As long as they are following the rules we have for safety, we just decided to give the grandparents some leway...even if it is hard at home for a few days after.

I don't think there's going to be a mother on this message board who doesn't have a relative like your mom. Once your children leave your sight, whether it's to go to a family member's house, daycare, school, wherever, you lose a lot of control over what's going to take place.

Most grandparents indulge their grandchildren. You have to sort out for yourself what about this situation is your OWN baggage and anger with your mom, and what actually pertains to your daughter.

I guess if I was in this situation, when she went to Nana's next time, I would sit them BOTH down and lay out your rules: bedtime, t.v., whatever the issues are. Also write the rules down ahead of time, and give them to your mom. This shows you are serious, and both your mom and your daughter have been told the same thing at the same time. Of course, your mom may not listen to you, and then you have to decide how much time you want your daughter to spend with her, and under what circumstances. You can't control your mother, only how you respond to her.

You are the mother, but I, personally, would not take away family outings as a punishment. Outings with friends, yes, but never with family.

E., Don't feel bad my mom is the same way I also have an older daughter now 8 and a son now 5 and my mom always wants to take my daughter by her self but never my son. she'll take him but when she takes both of them. And i also have the discipline problems she thinks we dont discipline correctly also. Like this summer she wanted to go to the car craft car show and also go to the state fair in august well lets just say we have a three strike rule in our house and you loose something if you get three strikes. she lost the car show and the state fair since the beginning of july and now she has to earn back both of the outings. And my mom thinks this is unfair, but if i give into her my daughter will think i wasent serious and will think she can get away with it. Im 35 and my mom was around all my childhood and she still does it to me so please dont feel bad your not the only one!!!
Stay Strong
L.

E.,

No, you were not over-disciplining. Even if you had been wrong, your mother needs to support your decisions as a parent.

I have the same problem (and many others) with my mom when it comes to boundaries and my children. She was very abusive as a mother and now she is trying to get a second chance by undermining my authority and parenting my kids herself. I have had to distance myself from her because having her around my children is toxic and causes problems every time she interacts with them. I limit her visits - both in duration and frequency - and have to be firm with her when she tries to undermine my authority or tries to play favorites with one of my children.

You are probably going to have to set up some boundaries. Decide how much of your mother's interaction you can handle and at what point it disrupts your family's harmony. Your mom should certainly be allowed to see and play with your children, but identify which certain situations cause the real problems and avoid those. It may mean that your daughter doesn't spend the night over at Nana's house. It may mean that her visits are just for a meal or you just meet her somewhere for a 1/2 day. It may mean that you avoid her house or yours. Whatever works for you and is right for your family.

If she starts yelling at you or fighting your parental decisions, you just end the conversation. You don't have to get angry (although it is tempting, I will admit.) Just tell her you have made your decision so there is no point in discussing it and you will talk to her another time.

One final word of caution - children are incredibly perceptive. If your daughter senses the problems between the two of you, she is likely to try to pit you against each other. Don't let this happen. Don't say a negative word about your mother when there is any chance your daughter can overhear. Children's hearing is incredibly acute when you don't want them to hear something.

Good luck,
S.

P.S. - I think there is a lot of wisdom in what Nicole said. And I agree that you need to choose another priviledge to remove when that is necessary. Nothing that has to do with your mom. She really doesn't need to know.