What Would You Do Regarding Estate Situation

Updated on July 03, 2012
L.B. asks from Berwick, ME
12 answers

Hi Mommas, I am asking the following question for a friend. In your opinion, (regarding the below) do you think that it is wise to see an attorney?

My friend's husband is one of 5 kids. In the 1970's their father passed away, the kids were pretty young. The father was a very wealthy man who owned a huge estate. The estate was willed to all 5 kids to share with the stipulation that the mother is in charge until she dies. Throughout the years the mother, an alcholic mismanaged the property.

The mother entered a nursing home several years ago and one of my friend's husband's brother, I will call Frank, became power of attorney. He is now managing the estate, which consist of several business and very valuable residential property. Frank, decided that he would take over one of the business and run it as his own. The other business are leased out to a third party for much less than they are worth. Frank has ostracized the other siblings and has been acting very nasty toward them. For example; freaking out when one asked for a copy of the will. He is always screaming and yelling that it is "his" business. No one has seen any of the accounting related to any of the businesses. They do know that some of the profits go toward the mothers care, which is reasonable. However, the other kids have not received any profit or benefit from the property. There is not a trust or accounts set up for them or anything. So basically, the brother Frank is doing whatever with the property and the money etc...

My friend's husband's siblings are at a loss of what to do, they all have a different idea as to what it going to happen to the property after the mother dies. They are not close with each other and only talk occasionally. They all agree that Frank is abusing his power of attorney. But do not know what to do about it. They would never get along running the businesses together. They don't know how to split up the property

The problem is, the other siblings have been against getting an attorney involved because they are afraid that an attorney will end up with the property and they are worried about attorney fees etc...They are worried that they will loose everything. But they have nothing at the moment. The mother is incompetent and the brother is abusing power of attorney and who knows what he is doing with the money that is being made from the estate. The husband knows that once he gets an attorney involved $#!+ will hit the fan!!!

The husband has tried talking to each sibling, he has arranged meetings to get everyone including Frank to discuss the situation and come to a resolution. He has suggested mediation from a mediator - some siblings agreed, some on the fence and Frank strongly refused mediation. In order for mediation to work everyone needs to be on board.

So, if this family asked you for your opinion or experience in a similiar matter, what would you say?

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So What Happened?

Thanks, I think that they should see the attorney. The kids were raised in a very dysfunctional family. The mom did not raise them, she had nannies and always put everyone elses needs above her kids. She was a raging alcholic. I know that my friend's husband was and always has been very loyal to his mother. She had a lot of problems. The kids all agree that a portion of the estate should be toward her care. They are not just trying to get her money. The property is in the kids names and she was placed in charge until she dies, she is incompetent and her power of attorney, the person that my friend's husband recommended be POA is runnitn the estate but not being forthright and making profit from it while the others in the family are being denied any interest. It is a complicated situation.

My friend and I realize that this is just a internet site, She asked me to ask the question, just to get an idea of what others would do. She realizes that she can't possibly explain all the circumstances, what was written above is summary of the situation. Not looking for legal advise, just opinions. Thanks again.

UPDATE: They decided to seek out a lawyers advice.
Just to clarify: Frank is the POA but does not take care of the mother the mother is in a nursing home, he never visits. My friend's husband visits and sends her cards etc... I saw the will it is crazy. The kids actually own the property but the mother is in charge until the day she dies then it gets turned over to the kids to run. The mother is incompetent to run the businesses, so FRank took over as POA and is running the business, the problems is he seems to be doing some shady things and the other kids have not been able to see the accounting etc....I will let you all know what happens - It seems like a crazy mess.

UPDATE - UPDATE - UPDATE
So, my friend's husband saw the attorney and the attorney agreed that his brothe Frankr is abusing power of attorney and mismanaging the property. The attorney is going to help my friend come up with a business plan to present to the brother. A plan that will protect all siblings and be in the best interest of the mother and the estate. Apparently the siblings are beneficiaries to the estate from when the father passed years ago. If the brother, POA refuses to work things out. They may pursue legal action to remove the brother from POA duties and assign a conservator.

Featured Answers

T.M.

answers from Redding on

The kids probably have "next of kin" rights... but I assume an attorney is the only way to go forward with this.
Maybe at least one sibling could go get some "free" legal advice to see where they stand and what steps might have to be taken.
Most towns have a free legal service for people that don't have enough money to consult an atty.
Frank does sound like he might be taking advantage of a situation, but the kids don't seem like they've given much of a damn about their mom in the past and now they want some money..... Maybe this is why Frank was nominated in the first place. Seems like it will be messy.

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C.O.

answers from Washington DC on

Hire an estate lawyer.
Hire a CPA to audit the books for the last 10 years - this will protect you and your family against any fraud that Frank may or may not have committed and hold him accountable.
Get a copy of the will for each family member and have a family meeting.
Your (or the) family has allowed Frank to take control with no accounting for his actions. It's time to have an accounting of his actions.

Tell your husband (or friends husband) to hire a lawyer and a CPA. Then when all is completed - ask for a buy out on your (his) portion of the estate. It could be a lose for future gains - who knows?

I can also state that being a caregiver to a parent is NO EASY TASK. And it's NOT cheap. Elderly care in FULLY ASSISTED living can be upwards of $5K a month.

Bottom line - if your husband doesn't like what is happening with the estate - he is well within reason to ask for an accounting of it.

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M.P.

answers from Pittsburgh on

Absolutely get an attorney!!! ITs shocking to me that the other siblings are not behind this as it is evident that the POA brother is robbing them blind. Umm-the first clue is that he won't show a copy of the will. Tell your friend that he does not have to have the blessing of the rest of the gang to pursuit what is rightfully his. If he plays his cards right they will most likely be thanking him. And don't worry about the relationship with Frank because obvioulsy Frank is not concerned about him.

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S.M.

answers from Washington DC on

Oh, my gosh yes, he should get an attorney for himself. Regardless whether his siblings are on board or not. They each should probably have their own initially. Keep in mind a real "mediator" can be legally binding. He needs representation first to figure out his rights and responsibilities. There is no way of telling what the legal relationship is - is it a "trust" or some other legal vehicle. Knowing this kind of thing has consequences. And the siblings' understanding from childhood may be completely wrong. And keep in mind, Frank has a lawyer no doubt. Most businesses have them on retainer. It is beyond stupid not to see an attorney.

PS - Getting an attorney doesn't mean anyone is suing anyone or going to court, etc. But the lawyer can get access to documents, like the original will which all parties are legally entitled too. Probably without even going through Frank. Mostly, this guy jus tneeds to get clarity and understanding, Action if needed can come later. But he needs to protect his own family and kids and not worry about crazy dynamics with the extended family.

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K.I.

answers from Los Angeles on

They NEED to ALL get in a room together and talk things out! That is the only thing I can think of besides hiring an attorney?

If the brother that is handling everything sees that all his brothers need questions answered or they will go to an attorney maybe that will help? It is the logical first step, anyway!

~My Grandmother left a hefty trust fund for myself and all her other grandchildren (10 kids total) and my Aunt was the executor of her will and she squandered all our $ and I never saw a dime, even though I was scheduled to get a lump sum when I was 25 and then another when I was 30 and then the last one when I was 35. I did have 1 cousin who hired an attorney and ya know what? He was the ONLY one to get his money. I was still just a kid when all this happened so by the time I became an adult all the $ was long gone and there was nothing I could do about it!

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C.H.

answers from New York on

Your friend's husband should hire an attorney to look into his rights and remedies in this situation. If the sibs decide they want to widen the scope of work to include their interests, they'd have to work out their own fee structures w/ the attorney. Whatever attorney fees there might be will probably be worth resolving all the uncertainties and bad blood that's building. I agree with the responder who said the primary caregiver may be entitled to a greater share (as someone who is primary caregiver to my MIL, I can assure you that even under the best circumstances it is a most difficult and sometimes thankless task --perhaps more so in such a dysfunctional family unit!).

As others have said, he has nothing to lose. As long as he approaches it from the point of view of his own rights and interests, he doesn't even have to deal w/ the sibs. If they want to let sleeping dogs lay, that's their choice. But if they take an interest after he makes an effort on his behalf, they should not expect any of the results w/o contributing to the cost of any actions that might benefit them. JMHO

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L.H.

answers from New York on

First of all, the mother isn't dead yet so all this is in poor taste from an ethical perspective; however, is it very common for families to break up over money and wills. This is why an attorney is always a good idea, but don't forget attorneys can be crooked too, so choose wisely. One of my questions is....anyone helping to take care of the mother or is Frank doing it all on his own? If he's doing it all on his own, he may feel entiled to some of the proffit. How would these other siblings feel if they were the sole caretaker? The best thing to do is to have the income from the estate carefully recorded and figured out to the tee, which would include giving Frank some kind of compensation for managing the businesses as well. This way everybody get a share of what ever proffit is left after the mother dies. They shouldn't be so quick to bury her. As for your friend having a hard time...She could request her inheritance early with something written up by an attorney that she already received it, but that will leave bad feelings from the others. The other thing she can do is figure out how she can save money....maybe by switching from an SUV to a small car, baking instead of buying prepared items, opting for cheap white bread, etc.

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M.C.

answers from Washington DC on

The siblings should see an estate attorney and possible an corporate/business attorney.

The business that Frank is running should be assessed for its current value. Frank should either establish a trust wherein all of the children share in the profits (and losses) or Frank, if he wants the business for himself should be the others out.

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P.G.

answers from Dallas on

Lawyer now. The lawyer will not "get" the property. He will get paid for his worth, and whoever is supposed to get the property, will get it. It's already hitting the fan, but with a lawyer, the husband will be able to deal with something. Since Frank is not cooperating, they don't have ANYTHIGN to lose. If for some reason, Frank legally gets everything, then nothing has changed. They need to get help.

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R.J.

answers from Seattle on

Of course Drank won't agree to anything. No matter what... He loses something... And he's been long shown to view it all as his.

Lawyer.

Your friend doesn't even have to get the subs on board. A lawyer purely representing his interest is FINE.

Do nothing. See nothing. Get lawyer. Will have to pay lawyer. But have a chance to actually SEE something. Say lawyer takes 10%. That still 90% divibded by 5. As opposed to 100% divided by 1.

Franks scare tactics have worked. Stop letting them. A total audit/ accounting/ and distribution is LONG overdue. Only a lawyer can help with that as Frank is treating everythingike his piggy bank.

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L.M.

answers from Cleveland on

i read throught the post so far and they seem reasonable.

He should be able to consult with an attorny with out going broke, and then go from there to decide if further action would make sense, but just like any service the attorny deserves to be paid for his time.

I think the biggest point i want to make is, that while yes it is worth pursuing this to a point, (since there already isn't a strong family bond, it doesn't seem like that matters. to me it's more how much upfront money and energy does your friend want to put into this.) how far you pursue it depends on what the lawyer finds out.

What bugs me a bit is that it sounds like Frank is the one caring for and dealing with elderly alcoholic mom, who probably isn't a picnic in the park to deal with. i always feel the sibling that is caring for the parent deserves more in compensation. but not knowing the whole story maybe there is more to it.

I guess what i started to say was that your friend in essence never had this money and shouldnt' get his hopes up that there is any left for him. that still isn't what i mean exactly, maybe don't count on it to change his situation, he should be working hard and making good decisions so that good things come to him by his own accord not from this dysfunctional family. Still not quite what i mean. I hope he does check it out and i hope there is some for all, and i would love an update someday.

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☆.A.

answers from Pittsburgh on

The mother is not dead yet.
The brother has legal power of attorney.
I would think that unless they can claim fraud (BIG difference than being a bad businessman) then they will have to wait until the mother dies to receive their shares.
Can your friend's husband ask for a LOAN against his future inheritance? Then they can subtract it from his share upon her death.

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