"Twice Exceptional" or a Problem No One Cares About --

No M. your child should not be blurting out in class. Imagine if 1 of her classmates got up and hopped around the room like a rabbit whenever he felt like it and another started singing 'God bless America' randomly. Neither are acceptable behavior while the teacher is trying to teach and both are as distracting to learning as your daughter blurting out things.

Our job as parents are to teach our children the rules and guidelines for living and working with others in the world. The more you push for bending rules the lower you are setting expectations for your child.

I think it's wonderful that your children want to learn new things all the time but there's more to education than book learning. They also need to learn how to work with others. I think you need to focus on the big picture instead of worrying about something like honor roll.

I think that unfortunately, the reality of the situation is that the individualized attention that you seem to think your kids deserve just isn't possible in any school system. With 18-25 or more kids in a classroom, your kids can't be disruptive. If the teachers make excuses for your childrens' behavior, then the other parents will take notice and complain that their children are being singled out, so the teachers have to be as fair as possible. That means that your daughter can't be excused for blurting out in class just because she is ''bright''. Part of being a well-rounded student is being able to behave and have responsibility for your actions.

It sounds to me like a little bit more understanding on your part is warranted. At the end of the day, if you think your children deserve more attention than they are getting at school (especially since you have tried more than one school, it sounds like), maybe you should homeschool them both.

We're not asking her age we're assuming your daughter is in High School or Middle school because it would be inappropriate to have honor roll for younger students. And because we're assuming your daughter is older and because YOU've described her as impolite I'm assuming you already knew calling out was a problem- this wasnt a complete surprise. As a Kindergarten/first grade teacher I will tell you calling out is a BIG issue - it takes away other kid's chance to think and learn. Unlike your kids- the majority of students need time to think and process. Couldn't you find your daughter a special program for gifted students? I'm sorry the school didn't communicate that the requirements for Honor roll were more than just good grades, that they are expected to be good students in more than one way. I hope you find the best program for your daughter and can help the school teach her how to be ready for the real world. I know some VERY intelligent people who cant hold a job because of their lack of social/people skills, is your daughter upset by not making honor roll? do you think it will make her think harder about her behavior in school?

You are in a catch 22. Public schools are the only schools that are legally required to follow any guidlines whatsoever for children with special needs; a private school has no obligation to recognize or accomodate ADHD. You could find a private school who did serve children with special needs, but this will be even more expensive than a typical private school is.

If you were in public school, I could tell you what to do for each of your children. While it is tricky, and some districts will be imposible to navigate, there are strategies that you can use to get twice exceptional children appropriate serivices, even if they are only accomodations for weaknesses and behavioral interventions. You would probably need the help of a skilled, possitve Special Edcuation Advocate to get what your kids need. Many public schools count on you not being able to get through the red tape and going elsewhere, however, with skilled help, you can make schools see the advantages of having IDEA elebile children who pass state mandated evaluations with high marks, it helps them in the long run.

My suggestion to you is to seek out the appropriate private therapy that will help them both be successful. If the visual issues are not run of the mill accuity issues (and I am assuming you are refering to visual motor, visual processing, and occular motor issues) then she would bennefit from OT and vision therapy. Cognative behavioral therapy would be a good addition for your daughter to learn some impulse control so that she no longer calls out in class. In a private school, they would also be under no obligation to cut a child with Tourette any slack either, not so in a public school, but in public school, children are served according to need, not diagnosis, so she would be accomodated even though her need was more commonly seen from kids who have tourrett, the diagnosis (or lable) really does not matter in terms of the IEP. Weekly cognative behavioral therapy will be essential for almost every child with ADHD. If she is not being managed by a psychiatrist, you may want to consider medical intervention. Once you are seeking theraputic interventions, having one more tool to help the therapy more effective, is very often the key to effective and long lasting progress. An inablity to suppress impulse is a common ADHD issue, and is one very specfic issue that responds to medical intervention with theraputic intervention very well.

As for your son, if he is not in speech therapy, I would seek some out. CAPD is very responsive to Linda Mood Bell methods, so if you can find a speech therapist who does these, you could help him significantly. There are other methods for sure, but this one comes to mind.

Here is my take on public schools: children do not fall through cracks, they fall through fingers. You can accomplish a great deal by advocacy, if the conditions are workable at your school district. Not knowing about yours, I can't say, some are unworkable. www.wrightslaw.com is a great place to learn about what to do, and you can find help from advocates on their yellowpages for your state.

M.

Ah -- That is the double -edged sword of private schools. People say they offer a better education but if that is true (and I am not even going to debate that point here) it is largely due to the fact that they get to make their own rules.

They can deny entry to kids with challenges/differences/disabilities/no funds. They are under little to no obligation to customize the education process via a 504 plan or an IEP. So of course they have it made...They discriminate against those with special needs in ways that public schools do not.

So they say being quiet and orderly and respectful and patient is a component of honor roll? That’s their call. You think it is an insurmountable obstacle to your child’s success? Try a new school or homeschool. I hear nothing but wonderful things about the success of homeschooling. You are already doing for one why not give two a shot?

Hi. I am sorry for your struggle and not getting the support. I know that kids with good grades don't get help unless the parents make it happen, usually at the parent's expense outside of school.

I taught in public and private schools. Honestly, public schools or a school for special needs kids would be the only ones able to meet needs. They have employees specially trained for this. My boss did a great disservice by allowing children to come to our private, Christian school where they didn't have their educational needs met. He wanted to help and always felt great empathy in these situations, but good intentions are not enough.

You are probally sensing that teachers avoid dealing with these sorts of problems except to punish. Sometimes teachers work in private schools for way less money to avoid these type of problems.

One of the reasons many parents pay top dollar for private school is to avoid disruptions to learning. Eventually they will be going to the principal wanting them to kick your child out. You don't want a group saying "Her kid or my kid" because the school would lose a lot more money by letting them all leave. The few children I have seen go through this take a huge hit emotionally and socially. It is not something I would ever allow my child to experience. It hurts to be made to leave for being "bad" and the kids never forget it.

This school is not what is best for your child and you can't make them be. Maybe someone here knows of resources and specialists in your area.

*Honor roll starts in 3rd grade at my child's school which surprised me.

They should have talked to you, but at the same time I do not think they are wrong for grading her down for behavior. Being a disruption affects the ability of all the other kids being able to learn. In my sons class they move up or down on a color system for behavior, and if they get orange or red, it is marked, and it should be. There are ways to help your daughter control her ADHD, and it would not fair to the children who work hard and behave to have your daughters bad behavior ignored.

Sorry, but it is really not acceptable to blurt out in class...this is something that you should figure out how to stop happening. You seem to just have accepted it and expect everyone else too as well. There are many ADHD kids in my kid's school and none of them just blurt out answers or disrupt the class to that point. Its unnacceptable in a classroom and in life in general. But....her teacher should have let you know that she was doing this and that it would jeopardize her getting on the honor roll.

You really should consider homeschooling your daughter also. Then you can be assured that she is getting an education that meets YOUR expectations. It is evident that you are unhappy with the public school and that feeling will probably get worse, not better.

I have been struggling with this also - my sons private school has an award giving ceremony for all the children, if they get an A in everything. Well son got an A in everything except handwriting - for which he got a zero, A ZERO!!!, He tries hard, but he has poor fine motor skills, and to me his handwriting doesn't look much worse than any other 8 year old boys, but he missed out and had to sit out and watch his friends get their awards - I thought it was so mean to give him a zero - private schools make up their own rules, have their own curriculum, and most of the time the teachers are not very well qualified - I am considering putting my son in public school, I tried homeschooling him, but with his ADHD, and a toddler running around it was impossible. my son also blurts out, and sings and hums to himself.
The teacher did not even tell me about the award ceremony things until afterward, she said that she had to mark his handwriting according to her guidelines which I understand.
I am rambling, and I don't really know what I am trying to say - except I hear ya!

It was wrong of the teacher not to discuss the situation with you earlier, but even a child with Tourette's should not blurt out in class. My husband has Tourette's, my son has autism, so don't think I am being unsympathetic. School is/was a struggle for both of them. When my son was diagnsed, we had to make a decision about using his self-stimulating behavior as a prize to condition appropriate behavior. It is a very personal choice, but I read a book that said if you accept it now, how would it look at age 25 if you were interviewing that child for a job? As a result, I did not allow the stim because I would not hire my son if I saw him doing that. Every parent can raise their child how they choose, I am just sharing my experience. Maybe your daughter is in the wrong school, maybe home schooling is the only thing that will work for her, but I also think you need to consider the long term goals. I don't like the idea that the teacher did not talk to you sooner, but you also say " I am tired of the schools complaining about my kids, and all the negative comments about my kids" which makes me think that you must have had some idea of what is happening. I am also sorry to hear that the public school system did not work for you. Generally the pub ed. has much better resources for children with special needs.
Good luck,
C.

I am in total agreement with you. A teacher absolutely should be alerting you to problems in school as soon as possible. A child does not deserve a bad grade just becuase she had a behavioral issue and this was not discussed with you. She never had a chance to correct herself! She may not have even been that aware that her blurting was a issue to begin with, or the discipline and warnings the teacher gave her just didn't process, not uncommon in ADHD kids (in which case you could have stepped in to help out). And one more thing, I read your 'So What Happened?" piece. I assumed your daughter is around 6-8 years old -- but honestly, it does NOT matter, IMO, how old she is. Every teacher should have the decency to approach a problem with the parent. Every negative consequence deserves a warning, otherwise it is unfair punishment.

I am with you on this all the way. If you have the time to homeschool, and already this is an issue, I say go for it. If you want, you can look at other options, but I think you are doing the right thing by not taking this issue as acceptable. It's not. That teacher should have said something to you...and now because she failed at her job your daughter has to pay for it. Not fair.

One other thing...for some of us who responded to M. B. -- I respect your opinions, but don't you think you are being a little too rigid? ADHD is an often misdiagnosed illness...therefore, folks who say they have it really don't, and the medication they are on is really curing something that is not there. BUT, for those with true ADHD, medication cannot fix everything. Even meds and therapy cannot fix it all...so, to me, calling out and blurting things out in class without following class rules is many times part of the condition. I would think that a competent, understanding teacher would be aware of this and accept a little of it here and there. I don't want to believe that your child's blurting was really that disruptive to the class; my gut on this is that her teacher was annoyed because she was not following rules. If she was really being disruptive, why didn't she contact you to let you know? Sorry, but to me, rules are not the most important thing...what is most important is that every child learns, thrives, and feels validated among her peers and treated fairly by her teachers.

I completely agree with you. I am having an issue with my daughter's teacher right now b/c she sends home weekly sheets about the kids behavior for the week. She'll check if they were good worker, little work done, talkative or if they got their name on the board. My daughter has pretty much been marked as talkative or name on the board at least once a week. When I get the report, my daughter, who's in 1st grade, doesn't always remember why she got her name on the board almost a week ago. I had to write her teacher last night to see if she would let me know the day of and what she did so I can address it with her (she doesn't put the reason on the weekly sheets). My daughter said when she was marked as "talkative" it was b/c she finished her work then was talking to a friend as they waited for the rest of the class to finish (Beauty of no child left behind I guess?).

We are going to start homeschooling next year. This "one size fits all" education is just not right for our kids. They are also very bright, my daughter is being made out to look like a bad child b/c she finishes her work, has to wait around for who knows how long for the rest of the class to finish so she gets bored and talks. At home, I can more on to the next lesson when she's done. Thanks for letting me vent! :)

So, yes, after all of my rambling about my problem, I agree you should be notified before it's on the report card.

even though it's a private school- it doesn't sound like a very good one. A good school would be working with both you and your daughter and they would let you know if there were any problems going on at school. I would take her out and spend some time finding a better school to put her in.
I have a friend with an ADHD son who wasn't getting the help he needed at school. The teacher wasn't very understanding at all and she would punish him for behavior he had a hard time controlling.
My friend pulled him out and home schooled him until they moved. He is now at a different school and is doing a lot better because the school and teachers are willing to work with him and his mom.
I am sorry you are going through this!
~C.

I think that parents are usually the best advocates for their children. I also think that it is important to pick your battles wisely when dealing with your children's education. I know you are very mad and fed up about this incident, but I think you need to look at the bigger picture--Is your daughter growing and thriving in this school? If not, are you capable of and willing to home schooling both of your children at home with their special needs? Or should you be looking for a different school environment for your child?

What are the policies at the private school your daughter attends, especially regarding notifying parents about grade or behavior issues? Is this a private school specifically for students with ADHD? What types of communication do they normally have with parents? How old is your daughter? How often do you make an attempt to contact the teacher during the course of the semester? You said that you are tired of the schools complaining about your kids and making negative comments, so you must have had some inclination that your child was having problems in the classroom. To not specifically inform you about the poor citizenship grade and the honor roll incident might or might not have been following school policy. Also, you may have failed to connect the dots, or the teacher may have not spelled out the policy to you (she may have communicated it to your child)--blurting out in class so many times =poor citizenship grade.

I know our protective instincts want us to "protect" our children from all harm and injustice. But I would look at her overall educational experience before I made a change in schooling. Good luck.

Unfortunately when you have your children enrolled in private schools there is no obligation to acknowledge their learning needs (b/c they don't accept Federal and State funding). You can have your daughter evaluated for special education by the public school and then bring the documentation to the private school and ask that they provide the accommodations under either IDEA (special education) or Americans with Disabilities Act (Section 504). Either way, it's not a guarantee!

I only have a minute, but there is a community on Facebook that is wonderful in Circle of Moms that is for moms of highly gifted kids. I haven't checked it out in quite awhile, but they used to have some very interesting posts there. You can probably get some good information there. I also read this book: Living with Intensity, http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0910707898/ref=oss_produ... . I found it very helpful. I hope it helps.

More moms than ever before are homeschooling. If you are successful with it for your son you will be successful with it for your daughter as well. I'd socialize them with other kids at other venues and yank them out of the failing American school system in order to make your stand that the education of our children is in dire need of repair.

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My son also has ADD and is in a private school. Not all teachers understand it well. You need to be in constant communication with her teachers and patiently working with them to do the best for your daughter.

Strange that the teacher didn't mention the problem on the mid-term interim. Hmm. Is your daughter disappointed that she didn't get Honor Roll? Or is it that you are more upset. If its more that you are bothered by it than she is, I would try to let it go. Holding on to it may upset her and cause her to have more issues with that teacher.

My son got mixed grades this term and didn't make it either. When the folder came home he was all lit up about if there was an award in there or not. When I told him he hadn't made honor roll, which I had shown him the paper last week so he knew he'd only gotten one A, he was disappointed. It confused me that he was expecting it since I had shown him the paper and he constantly forgets assignments.

Since you are already homeschooling your son, would you be able to juggle also homeschooling your daughter?