M. , i agree , counting to three, will only make it worse, i did that and too found it did not work well, they will do it at 3 cause they know you mean business, if you mean business right away you will get qicker action , this takes a while, cause in a sense you are not training him you are training you, i had to train me to not to count, and the bibles advice on making your yes, mean yes, and your no mean no, also helped in child rearing, if you say no to a child, and thenchange it to a yes, you are creating issues that will be hard to correct later, also visa versa, if you say this will happen if you dont do this, then follow through, so choose your words wisely, very hard to do sometimes, but think is that what i really want to uphold, if it is go for it, make a stand and stick to it, they will know exactly where you stand, and with counting to 3 they know you will only get ticked off when you reach 2, or maybe 2 1/2 .... 2 3/4.... hahahah quit counting, and let him know what is to be expected, if he does not do it , apply the expected, soon both of you will be happier, till hes 13, hahahahaha even then keep your word true, have a good day, and i know how hard it is, D. s